Joker: Folie à Deux Weekend Thread

[Kon]

17 minutes ago, Cooper Legion said:

If you think CM2 was about as good as CM1, or AM3 was bout as good as AM2, thw conclusions you’re going to come to are just going to be absurd. You’re entitled to whatever personal opinion on them you want but that is objectively not what the GA thinks about their quality, not even close to close to close.  
 

You will observe a change in outcome, and reason (falsely) that it wasn’t caused by a difference in movies so must be down to change in environment. But that’s totally fallacious. There was a huge change in movies that drove the change in outcome you just can’t notice it — luckily we have lots of data on aggregate reception, so you can use that to figure out what’s going on if you’re willing to let your personal interpretations not cloud the reasoning.

The thing is even the data at that time could be affected by the environment.

 

For example: It isn't difficult to see how the MCU brand being strong made people have a good predisposition towards individual films.

[TwoMisfits]

4 hours ago, titanic2187 said:

Just finished joker 2, the movie is definitely way better than what review or exit poll suggest. But the movie is just terribly anti crowd pleaser and anti-fans service. It is going to the direction that nobody desire. It is the TLJ moment of the Philip’s joker. The movie is not boring, but the outcome is. Its D cinemascore is an understandable one. 

 

People who get pissed at a movie always give the lowest scores...obviously, (almost) everyone is pretty angry at this movie, and Cinemascore reflects that...

Edited 20 hours ago by TwoMisfits

[MightyDargon]

Prediction: after this movie's run is over Phillips never gets to make a mainstream studio film again.

[PenguinHyphy]

Let’s have a more interesting conversation: Joaquin Phoenix has to be done, right? Every project of his since 2019’s Joker has been a bomb. (Shit, Beau Is Afraid’s bombing is responsible for having A24 pivoting to more commercial entities, according to The Wrap.) Now, even his franchise that catapulted him is becoming a historic bomb. Between that + the Todd Haynes situation, he has to become persona non-grata Hollywood. Todd Phillips does not come out the worst in this situation; it is Joaquin Phoenix.         

Edited 20 hours ago by PenguinHyphy

[MightyDargon]

Just now, PenguinHyphy said:

Let’s have a more interesting conversation: Joaquin Phoenix has to be done, right? Every project of his since 2019’s Joker has been a bomb. (Shit, Beau Is Afraid’s bombing is responsible for having A24 pivoting to more commercial entities, according to The Wrap.) Now, even his franchise that catapulted him is becoming a historic bomb. Between that + the Todd Haynes situation, he has to become persona non-grata Hollywood. Todd Phillips does not come out the worst in this situation; it is Joaquin Phoenix.         

Nah, Joaquin will get more work. The Todd Haynes film wasn't THAT important (and general audiences don't really know or care). He'll have to wait several years for anything high profile. Phillips is absolutely cooked as far as anything over a 20 mil budget for the forseeable future though and will NEVER get a high profile franchise again.

[Grand Cine]

I think the possibility to have BeetleJuice 2 6th Weekend above Joker 2 2nd Weekend is real

[filmlover]

Not sure it's been mentioned already but it's kind of incredible that WB put out three follow-ups to Best Picture nominees within the past decade this year and only one is looking to have anything to show for its legacy.

 

Dune Part 2: box office and critical smash that will be their #1 awards push this year.

 

Furiosa: earned strong reviews, but was rejected at the box office over the summer to the point where they won't bother pushing it even for tech nominations.

 

Joker 2: shaping up to be one of the biggest all around catastrophes in movie history.

[judestar619]

2 hours ago, thajdikt said:

And Thor 4 and Doctor Strange 2 made plenty of money despite having  awful reception. But just like SS and BVS it should have made much more due to interest and hype. It also gave a lot of brand damaged. Hence why Justice League something that should have been an Avengers level movie tanked. X-Men movies literally collapsed completely at the box office after Days of Future Past. Which the box office easily showed meanwhile Deadpool movies flourished. 
 

also Captain marvel got solid reviews and a A CS. The movie delivered on what people wanted from it. And using the one movie that got released right before the biggest movie event ever is a poor example to say every movie before could just be made and earn plenty of money. Fact is these movies were just much better before. Aquaman was received well by audiences, Wonder Woman aswell. That’s why the made much money not just because superhero was the shit. It’s funny because it’s what they are doing now that people say they did before. Just pump out mindless shit and expect it to make money but it doesn’t work like that. Quality has always been the biggest factor and always will be. The only two well received cbm movies last year made great money. The only one this year made great money. 

I mean "quality" is a very subjective phrase. What's considered "quality" in the 2010s might be considered tired and unoriginal in the 2020s. Audiences tastes change and that's normal, I feel studios have taken the MCU style of superhero quippy comedy as far as it can go and audiences are starting to reject it because they are not seeing anything new. I agree that the movies have gotten worse (on average), but it's true that a lot of mediocre CBM's got away with releasing under a more forgiving climate.

[SchumacherFTW]

10 minutes ago, MightyDargon said:

Prediction: after this movie's run is over Phillips never gets to make a mainstream studio film again.

Of course he will, this isn't a heaven's gate situation 

[ZeeSoh]

1 hour ago, AJG said:

Would it be possible to have a “JUST THE NUMBERS” thread so we don’t have to wade through all this conversation?

 

57 minutes ago, Eric Quinn said:

I mean once we get actual numbers, the conversation will pivot. I’m pretty sure this whole “are CBMs dead tho” conversation is about to wrap up now. And if not? Then I’ll use my mod powers to stop it when I think it’s needed. Now is not the time.

We have never, as far as I recall, had numbers thread without conversations. If you want pure numbers you can follow accounts like Charlie/BORreport/etc, on twitter for quick and updated numbers. 
 

And the entire point of weekend threads is to have a conversation about anything you want. Even if the conversation has nothing to do about movies or box office or anything related. That has been the case since the forums started. 

[MightyDargon]

I find it interesting that nobody pulled a "NO MORE MUSICALS EVAR!!!!" card for the "brilliant" discussion on this film prior but I'm also certain that even the unlucky paying audiences realized Joker 2 was probably the shittiest cop out of a musical imaginable in format, so that's not going to happen.

[PenguinHyphy]

13 minutes ago, MightyDargon said:

Nah, Joaquin will get more work. The Todd Haynes film wasn't THAT important (and general audiences don't really know or care). He'll have to wait several years for anything high profile. Phillips is absolutely cooked as far as anything over a 20 mil budget for the forseeable future though and will NEVER get a high profile franchise again.

It is not about audiences knowing or caring. If he has a history of bailing on projects, then it is going to be hard to get him insured or to get financing for the  project. Studios are not going to want to take on that liability either if everything he touches bombs anyway. It is not as if he has ever top lined a hit outside of The Joker anyway, so he is not exactly Leonardo DiCaprio or Will Smith 

Edited 20 hours ago by PenguinHyphy

[MightyDargon]

1 minute ago, SchumacherFTW said:

Of course he will, this isn't a heaven's gate situation 

Ohhhhh yes it is.

 

If Proyas can't get work a decade after Gods of Egypt, this movie (which was supposed to be WB's flagship for the 2nd half of 2024) absolutely will capsize Phillips.

[filmlover]

Don't think we need a crystal ball to predict that Todd Phillips will be fine in the long run even if it means streaming projects. He just won't be getting a gig like this again.

[AniNate]

The Hangover is approaching the nostalgia phase and he's still friends with Bradley Cooper. Think Part IV could be on the docket.

[MightyDargon]

1 minute ago, filmlover said:

Don't think we need a crystal ball to predict that Todd Phillips will be fine in the long run even if it means streaming projects. He just won't be getting a gig like this again.

Nah, there's plenty of directors that actually did shoot their careers to hell. How much did Verbinski actually do after Lone Ranger? 1 movie? Phillips is a lot more disposable than people realize. And he ain't getting that Hogan movie BROTTHHHHERRRR

[Eric Quinn]

1 minute ago, AniNate said:

The Hangover is approaching the nostalgia phase and he's still friends with Bradley Cooper. Think Part IV could be on the docket.

They’re gonna have Jacob Tremblay play the baby from the first movie.

[MightyDargon]

I'm sure "Hangover 4: How Much Can I Drink Before Prostate Cancer Gets Me" will be a multi Academy Award winner in 2029

[judestar619]

Todd Phillips will probably still be able to make movies but he'll be kept on a leash with small budgets. A B- cinemascore would've been bad, but to get a CBM to a D implies genuine seething hatred from the audience. That's not something a studio will ever forget. This definitely will harm his career.

[PenguinHyphy]

Todd Phillips has a history of hits. He will be alright, but Phoenix, on the other hand…