The Batman | March 4, 2022 | Warner Bros. | Certified Fresh on RT | 7th Most Profitable Movie of 2023

[Fielding]

On 3/18/2022 at 3:34 AM, Hatebox said:

- But a much bigger problem is that the central mystery driving the plot is... not very interesting. I appreciate this wasn't another end-of-the world narrative but in a three-hour why-dunnit you really have to care about the 'why'. I'm neutral on Dano, from what little we saw of him he was exactly as I expected. I almost forgot he was in the movie at points.

 

- Because the central mystery wasn't interesting the plot in the second half became very 'and then this happens, and this happens, and then this happens'. I knew when we saw those damn twins answer the club door for a third time it was beyond the point of no return. A real shame becuase the beginning of the movie is incredible.

 

 

 

Thank you! After all the blather from Reeves about how he was going to craft a real mystery that concentrated on Batman's skills as a detective, imagine my disappointment when I was confronted with an utterly un-mysterious screenplay that consisted of one hideous info-dump after another and artless, heavy-handed dialogue. Has Reeves actually seen a noir classic? It was very poorly written and I'm worried that its box-office performance will simply encourage the studio to allow him free rein for the sequels.

 

Anyway, it's not a patch on the Nolan trilogy.

[Joyous Legion]

Yeah I let myself get kind of hyped up by the noir mystery kind of chatter and it was sort of a let down on that front. Noir aesthetic vibes are no substitute for a good noir plot.

[Last Man Standing]

This would've been so much better if it were an hour shorter. At least it looked amazing, Greig Fraser is killing it.

[WittyUsername]

How would making this an hour shorter even work? This isn’t the Snyder Cut, where there are plenty of scenes that come off as unnecessary filler. Most of the scenes are there to advance the plot. There’s only really one scene near the end that I think could’ve been cut. 

[Spidey Freak]

13 hours ago, WittyUsername said:

How would making this an hour shorter even work? 

 

It can end at 

Spoiler

Falcone's death and be a taut noir mystery, with the Riddler still at loose. The last act with 8chan Riddler, lol Joker cameo and shoehorned city catastrophe feel like a different film altogether.

 

Not saying I didn't enjoy those parts to an extent (except for the Joker cameo which was unnecessary AF) and I did appreciate the ambition as I vastly prefer an overstuffed movie to an underdeveloped plot and characters, But the film really felt like it came to a conclusion with Falcone being revealed and assassinated. Everything after that transparently transmitted Uh I guess we have to include a big final act action set piece so the movie needs to go on for another hour. The lesson Batman learns about vengeance could easily have come about by Riddler signing off as "I Am Vengeance" after killing Carmine. We didn't need an entire incel army and a huge flood to drive home that point.

 

Edited March 21, 2022 by Spidey Freak

[Lucas]

The third act rules.

[Dragoncaine]

1 hour ago, Spidey Freak said:

 

It can end at 

  Hide contents

Falcone's death and be a taut noir mystery, with the Riddler still at loose. The last act with 8chan Riddler, lol Joker cameo and shoehorned city catastrophe feel like a different film altogether.

 

Not saying I didn't enjoy those parts to an extent (except for the Joker cameo which was unnecessary AF) and I did appreciate the ambition as I vastly prefer an overstuffed movie to an underdeveloped plot and characters, But the film really felt like it came to a conclusion with Falcone being revealed and assassinated. Everything after that transparently transmitted Uh I guess we have to include a big final act action set piece so the movie needs to go on for another hour. The lesson Batman learns about vengeance could easily have come about by Riddler signing off as "I Am Vengeance" after killing Carmine. We didn't need an entire incel army and a huge flood to drive home that point.

 

Spoiler

The vengeance lesson wouldn't work nearly as well imo if we didn't actually see Batman caring for and helping people in the film's closing moments, which helps drive home the message. As written, if the movie wrapped up after Falcone's death with an I'M VENGEANCE signoff, the stakes wouldn't have been nearly as high to put the people of Gotham in danger. I can see how it didn't work for you, but losing an hour seems wild to me.

 

Edited March 21, 2022 by Dragoncaine

[Spidey Freak]

12 hours ago, Dragoncaine said:

The vengeance lesson wouldn't work nearly as well imo if we didn't actually see Batman caring for and helping people in the film's closing moments, which helps drive home the message. As written, if the movie wrapped up after Falcone's death with an I'M VENGEANCE signoff, the stakes wouldn't have been nearly as high to put the people of Gotham in danger. I can see how it didn't work for you, but losing an hour seems wild to me.

 

Spoiler

There could have been a quick closing scene where Bruce vows to focus on being a beacon of hope to the citizens of Gotham by saving the Mayor's surviving family from a mugger or something and comforting them. I just didn't think an entire hour was needed for that especially when the first two acts were so tonally different.

 

[Hatebox]

If you really wanted to be brutal and make it two hours you could start with cutting out Selina altogether. She didn’t affect the plot that much. Trouble is it’s then just a sausage fest.

 

Spoiler

I didn’t mind the whole flooding angle - the fight scenes in the venue were good and drove home batman’s desperation - but I thought the final voiceover, ie. the movie’s theme, was a half-baked cover version of TDK’s. If that had been the subtext all along it must have gone over my head, because it felt too little too late for me.

 

[Menor the Destroyer]

1 hour ago, Dragoncaine said:

  Reveal hidden contents

The vengeance lesson wouldn't work nearly as well imo if we didn't actually see Batman caring for and helping people in the film's closing moments, which helps drive home the message. As written, if the movie wrapped up after Falcone's death with an I'M VENGEANCE signoff, the stakes wouldn't have been nearly as high to put the people of Gotham in danger. I can see how it didn't work for you, but losing an hour seems wild to me.

 

Spoiler

After signing off with "I am Vengeance," Riddler actually attempts to flee, wreaking havoc during the chase. At some point Batman is forced to choose between saving some civilians endangered by their violence and chasing down Riddler. He chooses to save the civilians, leaving the police to chase Riddler, leading him to become more trusted by the people of Gotham. 

 

[Dragoncaine]

3 minutes ago, Menor Reborn said:

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After signing off with "I am Vengeance," Riddler actually attempts to flee, wreaking havoc during the chase. At some point Batman is forced to choose between saving some civilians endangered by their violence and chasing down Riddler. He chooses to save the civilians, leaving the police to chase Riddler, leading him to become more trusted by the people of Gotham. 

 

That's really interesting. In this imaginary version,

Spoiler

would the police still catch Riddler by the end of the story?

 

[Menor the Destroyer]

1 hour ago, Dragoncaine said:

That's really interesting. In this imaginary version,

  Reveal hidden contents

would the police still catch Riddler by the end of the story?

 

Spoiler

Yes, otherwise the film would feel too unresolved. 

 

[Dragoncaine]

1 hour ago, Menor Reborn said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Yes, otherwise the film would feel too unresolved. 

 

Spoiler

Agreed. I also think ending the movie on an ongoing pursuit/chase of the villain would feel too similar to TDK's vigilante chase ending.

 

[AnotherDayAnotherDollar]

I think I predicted 400MM Domestic, 950MM WW without China and 1.1B with China. Think I'll be short WW and low domestic.

[belblazer]

8.7 on Maoyan

 

At least they really liked it.

[TrevorBelmont9078]

14 hours ago, Spidey Freak said:

 

  Hide contents

There could have been a quick closing scene where Bruce vows to focus on being a beacon of hope to the citizens of Gotham by saving the Mayor's surviving family from a mugger or something and comforting them. I just didn't think an entire hour was needed for that especially when the first two acts were so tonally different.

 

That honestly would feel like such a shoe-horned in moment concocted to spoon-feed the message to the audience. The actual ending does it a lot more organically, as there's a real need for Batman to actually become a hero in the end, not because someone's getting their purse stolen in the street but because the city he has vowed to protect, is hurting - and it needs a hero. Not Vengeance.

[Coneilg93]

So, we’re in the era if it doesn’t hit a billion that means it’s flop? Lol I’m reading that online, geez. 

[AdrianL]

2 hours ago, Coneilg93 said:

So, we’re in the era if it doesn’t hit a billion that means it’s flop? Lol I’m reading that online, geez. 

Grace Randolph literally just made a 18 minute video on why this should hit a billion... embarassing.

[Joyous Legion]

9 hours ago, belblazer said:

8.7 on Maoyan

 

At least they really liked it.

Pretty medium score. 8.6 now is approaching medium-bad.

[35MM-18]

12 minutes ago, AdrianL said:

Grace Randolph literally just made a 18 minute video on why this should hit a billion... embarassing.

It's Grace Randolph. That's reason enough for most people in this thread to ignore it.