redfirebird2008 Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 20 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said: A2 beating EG record in digital/rental sales is insane to me. It’s one thing for these movies to do well theatrically, that’s what they’re made for. Another entirely for them to be breaking records outside of the box office. A2 is yet another outright phenomenon from Cameron, there is no way around it at this point. Especially when you consider the drastically different landscape for Hollywood in Japan and China today means it could have maybe even beaten the WW box office record if those two markets were what they once were for Hollywood. It’s just insane bc I don’t think anyone is wrong for saying the first film left no real pop culture footprint for well over a decade. It kinda didn’t. Then on top of that, A2 didn’t have some kind of industry changing hook like A1’s 3D and visuals that were beyond what anyone had seen before. Sure visuals are still boundary pushing for A2, but people are used to insane visuals these days from CGI in a way they weren’t with A1. The fact that it’s doing these kind of numbers outside of the theater is just further proof that it might not even be the visuals that we’re driving the success so much. People just outright want to see this movie I guess and Cameron has yet again made one of the biggest cinematic successes ever. It’s all mind blowing really. Nobody can doubt Cameron at this point. I just find it a bit sad that he’s going to spend a huge chunk of his career on a single franchise. It feels like we’re missing out on some potentially cool original movies from him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel M Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Cameron should start planting articles online with titles like "Does anyone care for an Avatar 3?" just for good luck. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAtGender Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Cameron has a few really niche interests and is going to focus all his energy on those interests. I think one of the reasons the Avatar films grab audiences but don't really generate conversation is that we're all just along for his ride. It's like he's saying "I'm going to do my thing and I'm going to do it my way and I'm going to love it completely". And it's not just that the films are amazing technically but that the experience of seeing someone so focused on generating that vision for the screen is amazing to behold. It's like talking to someone who is telling you about something that they are really interested in but you aren't particularly interested, but you enjoy the experience just because of their enthusiasm, even though you don't have a whole lot to add. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroHour Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Whenever people talk about the Avatar films having no cultural impact, it usually boils down to two critiques, that the plots are kind of cliched and the characters kind of forgettable. Those things aren't entirely untrue, but Avatar is a reminder that film is a visual medium and Cameron directs the crap out of them. It's not just the quality of the visual effects (which are fantastic) but his absolute mastery of visual film language. When it comes to creating action and visual set pieces, he's the best director working today and I don't think anyone else comes close. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kon Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 37 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said: A2 didn’t even get rave reviews to boost it. Quite the opposite, reviews were about as uneventful as it gets. In many ways A2 in theory was perfectly set up to be this massive implosion from the first film’s success, and the entire opposite is what actually happened and we ended up with Cameron somehow doing it again. Basically we need a movie from him that everyone expects is going to be a juggernaut, and then it will probably flop lol. I would say there were rave reviews about the visuals of Avatar 2. Everyone were saying how amazing and groundbreaking were the effects. The uneventful parts of the reviews were about the plot and characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kon Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, ZeroHour said: Whenever people talk about the Avatar films having no cultural impact, it usually boils down to two critiques, that the plots are kind of cliched and the characters kind of forgettable. Those things aren't entirely untrue, but Avatar is a reminder that film is a visual medium and Cameron directs the crap out of them. It's not just the quality of the visual effects (which are fantastic) but his absolute mastery of visual film language. When it comes to creating action and visual set pieces, he's the best director working today and I don't think anyone else comes close. This situation reminds me to Fantasia. Fantasia movie doesn't really have a plot, but the really important is the animation and the mastery of the visuals. Edited August 10, 2023 by Kon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfirebird2008 Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 5 minutes ago, ZeroHour said: Whenever people talk about the Avatar films having no cultural impact, it usually boils down to two critiques, that the plots are kind of cliched and the characters kind of forgettable. Those things aren't entirely untrue, but Avatar is a reminder that film is a visual medium and Cameron directs the crap out of them. It's not just the quality of the visual effects (which are fantastic) but his absolute mastery of visual film language. When it comes to creating action and visual set pieces, he's the best director working today and I don't think anyone else comes close. He has been the best action director since 1986 with Aliens or 1991 with Terminator 2, perhaps even as far back as 1984 with the original Terminator movie on a small budget. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojoguy Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Cameron could have retired on a island comfortably after all that money he made from the first Avatar, instead he decided to work hard over the next 2 decades on more these blue people movies. People are so ungrateful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolioD1 Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 the people love jake sully. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojoguy Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 4 minutes ago, CoolioD1 said: the people love jake sully. Also Sam Worthington has got to eat. Without his Avatar pay, he would have a dead career and would be a hobo with a shotgun living on the streets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dephira Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, MovieMan89 said: A2 beating EG record in digital/rental sales is insane to me. It’s one thing for these movies to do well theatrically, that’s what they’re made for. Another entirely for them to be breaking records outside of the box office. A2 is yet another outright phenomenon from Cameron, there is no way around it at this point. Especially when you consider the drastically different landscape for Hollywood in Japan and China today means it could have maybe even beaten the WW box office record if those two markets were what they once were for Hollywood. It’s just insane bc I don’t think anyone is wrong for saying the first film left no real pop culture footprint for well over a decade. It kinda didn’t. Then on top of that, A2 didn’t have some kind of industry changing hook like A1’s 3D and visuals that were beyond what anyone had seen before. Sure visuals are still boundary pushing for A2, but people are used to insane visuals these days from CGI in a way they weren’t with A1. The fact that it’s doing these kind of numbers outside of the theater is just further proof that it might not even be the visuals that we’re driving the success so much. People just outright want to see this movie I guess and Cameron has yet again made one of the biggest cinematic successes ever. It’s all mind blowing really. Avatar 1 and 2 both definitely left their mark on the cinematic landscape, and for good reason. I will die on this hill defending them (and I truly believe they have above average characters and plot, when comparing them to the Top 50 WW Box Office Hits, which are more often than not visual spectacles rather than Tolstoy-level writing). I watched Avatar 2 close to Black Panther 2, and I'm not exaggerating when I say that Black Panther 2 looked like a Playstation 1 game in comparison. They both feature big battles on a ship during the final act (both even involve whale-like creatures), and the way that the BP2 actors fumble and attack the green screen with their plastic weapons genuinely looks like a 3rd-grade theater production in comparison (with respect). Even on a home TV (and those TVs are pretty big nowadays), A2 looks like a different generation of filmmaking. It's like saying that after Ben Hur (1950s), audiences got used to amazing visuals, so it's inexplicable why the visuals of Titanic turned it into a must-see specatcle. I also loved, loved, loved Endgame in theaters, and the final long fight sequence just doesn't compare in any way to the heft and viscerality that A2 conveys with such seeming easiness. Edited August 10, 2023 by Dephira 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGPatt2 Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Cameron is simply a genius. The action scenes in Avatar and Avatar: The Way of Water are so far superior and more engaging than anything that Marvel, DC, Jurassic World, Fast, or any other blockbuster franchise puts out. I re-watched Titanic over the weekend and it's unreal how grandiose and ginormous that movie feels. Even 26 years later with movies spanning the universe, this still feels like the biggest movie ever. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Prime Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 17 minutes ago, CoolioD1 said: the people love jake sully. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robertron Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 5 minutes ago, Dephira said: Avatar 1 and 2 both definitely left their mark on the cinematic landscape, and for good reason. I will die on this hill defending them (and I truly believe they have above average characters and plot, when comparing them to the Top 50 WW Box Office Hits, which are more often than not visual spectacles rather than Tolstoy-level writing). I watched Avatar 2 close to Black Panther 2, and I'm not exaggerating when I say that Black Panther 2 looked like a Playstation 1 game in comparison. They both feature big battles on a ship during the final act (both even involve whale-like creatures), and the way that the BP2 actors fumble and attack the green screen with their plastic weapons genuinely looks like a 3rd-grade theater production in comparison (with respect). Even on a home TV (and those TVs are pretty big nowadays), A2 looks like a different generation of filmmaking. It's like saying that after Ben Hur (1950s), audiences got used to amazing visuals, so it's inexplicable why the visuals of Titanic turned it into a must-see specatcle. I also loved, loved, loved Endgame in theaters, and the final long fight sequence just doesn't compare in any way to the heft and viscerality that A2 conveys with such seeming easiness. Completely agree, especially with your comparison to BP2. I’ve seen A2 twice - first in theatres, and most recently as an in-flight movie. Even on a tiny 8inch screen it still manages to be a grand spectacle that others won’t match. Cameron has a good thing going so let the man do his thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainbug Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Said it during Avatar 2's run, but i definetly believe that one core reason for the Avatar films' success are their simplicity. The storys are generic and cliche, but i dont mean that in a negative way, Cameron uses storys and character dynamics that everyone has seen somewhere before because that feeling of familiariy - when used properly - creates a sort of story-safe place for the viewers. And on top of that, simple storys have the massive bonus that everyone can understand them. Basically, you dont need a brain for Avatar, you just need eyes. Avatar 1 and 2 dont want to win any screenplay oscars. They also dont want to play with super deep themes. They just want to entertain the biggest amount of people possible - and also, since the heroes have blue skin color, everyone on Planet Earth can relate to them since everyone regardless of race, gender etc. can see themselves in the blue peoples shoes. Its honestly the perfect recipe for a worldwide blockbuster. I hope its understandable what i mean. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayumanggi Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 1 hour ago, Kon said: Not every person like all movie genres. Honestly, I've never been interested in Avatar 2, since the visual seems to be the more interesting aspect of the movie. I think I never said everyone should like all movie genres. What I said is that before I make judgment on a movie, I try to see it first so that I know what I'm talking about. If for some people, judging movies without seeing them first is a thing, I guess that's fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayumanggi Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 600M overseas for BARBIE. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlangonz Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 Like someone said early I think love for Avatar just goes unnoticed. People I know irl that enjoyed or even love it are people that rarely talk about movies and would never say a word or post anything related to their taste for these movies. Between the original and the sequel I actually never met someone irl that told me how much they like/love it until the rerelease came out. It's a saga of its own time and people would wait until the next one to discuss it and so on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M37 Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 17 minutes ago, kayumanggi said: I think I never said everyone should like all movie genres. What I said is that before I make judgment on a movie, I try to see it first so that I know what I'm talking about. If for some people, judging movies without seeing them first is a thing, I guess that's fine. It’s not making a judgement, an up or down quality assessment, but knowing one’s taste, particularly when it involves a commitment of time and money. Something can be of “good” quality and still unappealing to an individual I’ve seen enough movies in my life to have a good idea of what I will or won’t enjoy without having to sit through the entire viewing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valonqar Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 41 minutes ago, KGPatt2 said: Cameron is simply a genius. The action scenes in Avatar and Avatar: The Way of Water are so far superior and more engaging than anything that Marvel, DC, Jurassic World, Fast, or any other blockbuster franchise puts out. I re-watched Titanic over the weekend and it's unreal how grandiose and ginormous that movie feels. Even 26 years later with movies spanning the universe, this still feels like the biggest movie ever. also, editing and sound editing are to die for. If there's one reason to watch Titanic it's Cameron's editing for which he won the Oscar too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
