Wonder Woman (2017)

[baumer]

Discuss

[Amadeus]

OK, so this is so good. It's a simple straight movie. The characters have motivations. They are well defined. They are funny to watch. 
It's beautifully shot and tells the story more through pictures rather than dialogue. 
It knows what it wants to be and it is what it wants to be: melodramatic, fun, beautiful, big. A success. 

A- (Very good! Executed with precision and determination.)

Edited May 31, 2017 by Amadeus

[antovolk]

I see why this film has done so well with Rotten Tomatoes - it's what people (especially critics) have been yearning for - following Snyder's ambitions to tell his own thing with these characters in MoS and BvS, and whatever Suicide Squad was - this is back to basics, no shared universe obligations or connections save for the clearly studio-mandated opening and closing, stick to the formula - and it's done *well* and with charm.

Yes, it is and it feels formulaic - partly because it's an origin story, partly because of the war setting (Cap 1 is obvious point of comparison), and let's not talk about that finale and the opening/closing voiceover scenes. But - the first two and a half acts are actually surprisingly good and here's the main thing about this film. Jenkins' direction and flair, Gadot, Pine, the merry band (SPUD! and co), Lucy Davis (Etta), the Amazons (what we got of Nielsen/Wright is awesome) - it lends this such a charm and all these elements seriously elevate everything, even that final half-act. It's a joy to watch, it's such a crowdpleaser, probably first such one in this comic book film landscape since the first Avengers. The chemistry between Gadot and Pine deserves special mention, they are great on screen together. Other special mentions - Gregson Williams does a fantastic job weaving and re-orchestrating that 'riff' and teasing it throughout the score - and when it does make an appearance it's glorious. And very much jiving with the vibe that Jenkins approached this with - the cinematography is really lush. Damn you IMAX for not doing 2D screenings.

It's super easy to say that with this film DC/WB 'finally did it like Marvel' - and quite frankly in a lot of things, either by design or not, they did, namely the 'back to basics' stuff I mentioned and the formulaic nature of the story, oh and the usual villain problem. But here's the thing (as rightly just pointed out some of it's down to the Reeve/Donner Superman inspiration - I haven't watched them so I may be mistakenly chalking this up to Jenkins and co) - Jenkins brings a unique flair and eye and most importantly charm to this, closest and probably only example in the MCU being what Gunn has done with Guardians. (for what it's worth, I feel it's definitely Guardians and Iron Man-level if we're using MCU's origin story films as a barometer) In the larger DC Universe context, it's pretty much what I signed up for - different direction coming in with their own eye on the material. Some like Snyder went deeper into making their own story and perspective out of it, Jenkins here brings her eye and charm without playing around deeper with Diana's story (there's a reason why she kept saying so much in interviews that she just just 'telling her story'). Do filmmakers have to respect and revere the source material or should they be allowed freedom to do their own 'fanfic' of it? This whole DC Films saga has been incredibly fascinating so far in feeding into that debate. Overall, this is definitely the most 'even' and least flawed DCEU film so far, it's not my favourite though (that goes to the 3-hr cut of BvS, with MoS and this on par in 2nd place).

TL;DR - go see it, I had a great time. And again, Gadot is awesome and I cannot wait to see more of her.

7.5/10

P.S. Technical notes: saw in IMAX 3D - presented fixed 2.40:1, no expanded image (why did they put out that 1.9:1 framed TV spot with expanded image then??). And 3D conversion is meh, very flat overall, felt 2D at times but not really watchable with glasses off.

[Biggestgeekever]

Now that I've had some time to think about it more, I'll post a proper review. Because I find the movie to be such a mixed bag, I'll start by putting up grades for each act:

 

First act: C+

Second act: B/B+

Third act: D

 

It seems the first act is the place where I diverge the most from people who have seen and reflecting on it, I think it's probably better than my first impression was. It’s still pretty rough, in my opinion, and that’s for the following reasons:

 

1. the mythology was just not for me. I know it is taken from the comic book character, but introducing actual greek gods is just too out-of-left-field in this universe. It is the same issue I had whenever X-Files would do religious themed episodes.
2. I found the Amazons to be a complete bore outside of combat. Almost none of them leave a lasting impression since the film offers no explanation for what these women do outside of training. I am glad that Gal Gadot was not forced to do a foreign accent in BvS, but it quite frankly bizarre to hear all the Amazons try to do an impression of her’s.
3. We’re given no reason why Themyscira represents some greater society. The island sure is pretty, but this doesn't come off like a place that would be remotely exciting for more than a day vacation.
4. This is more of a retroactive reason, but here we go. I think Robin Wright does an admirable job, and becomes close to the only Amazon that gets close to being engaging. But she's killed off and is never brought up again, even though it's sold in the moment as a massive emotional loss for Diana. It doesn't even seem to play into Diana's reasoning for going to London.

Outside of how that death is handled by the rest of the movie, I don't have any complaints. I did find the dynamic of these incredibly strong, well-trained warriors still suffering severe casualties from guns to be interesting.

 

The second act has some really great stuff, like the No Man’s Land siege, which I honestly think is one of the best action scenes I’ve seen in a superhero film (some very poor CGI notwithstanding). But the notHowling Commandos do, by my approximation, drag the film down. They each have an issue that alone would be worthy for the film to tackle (PDST! Racism! Manifest Destiny!) that it’s impossible for the movie to get even a superficial treatment of them. I think taking them out and giving more time to Additionally, the fish-out-of-water humor, while often funny, is the film trying to have its cake and eat it. Diana is incredibly smart and learned, but is forced to come off to naïve at the same time. It feels like there are way to derive humor from this situation while commenting on the sexism of the time period (some of which, of course, still occurs today) without resorting to her expressing childlike wonder over ice cream. Still, the aforementioned action sequence really is spectacular, and Chris Pine and Gal Gadot have remarkable chemistry.

 

That third, though… the more one thinks about it, the more it completely falls apart. I think the film starts to lose me at the gala, where Danny Huston talks to Diana about gods. It lays on that he’s Ares so thick that I immediately knew he couldn’t be. But what’s even more bizarre is how those lines are completely nonsensical in the context of him not being Ares. The actual reveal of Ares consequently lands with a thud. And the fight is, as has been posted before, an embracing of everything wrong with CGI battles.

 

Of course, this is nothing new to DCEU films. But what makes it so disappointing here is the very complex, intriguing themes the film was tackling just prior to this big reveal. The great version of this movie has her dealing with these feelings for the rest of the runtime, perhaps even saving her conclusions about humanity until a sequel. Sure, Ares is actually controlling humans, he is merely telling them about the best way to kill each other. That still makes this far too black and white for me, and doesn’t really track anyway, considering World War 2 is just around the corner (unless, GOD FORBID, they bring Ares back). The fight itself is even more of a spectacular misfire considering how strong much of the action before is. Ares is a Doomsday who monologues endlessly.

 

I’m less certain how to digest Diana’s faith in humanity being restored by Trevor’s proclamation of love. They’re chemistry is so good that it works more than it should, but it all feels too quick and too typical. Again, I think the smart choice would have been for Diana to end this film with conflicting feelings about humanity, neither a total abandonment nor holding a “love conquers all” philosophy.

Overall, it is generally a step forward for the DCEU. But it should have been several. You can see the filthy fingerprints of the braintrust behind this series’ other films on the last act, so I truly hope the commercial and critical success of this movie allows Patty Jenkins to create a more cohesive sequel. If she can, that film could truly be a home run.

Edited June 1, 2017 by Biggestgeekever

[MCKillswitch123]

Ok, so, Wonder Woman. Finally, we get this movie. Now, you guys may or may have not read my negative review on Man Of Steel, middle of the road review on Batman V Superman and downright RANT on Suicide Squad. The DCEU hasn't been doing so well, and this movie, I think, was its last hope, all things considered.

 

Well, the hopes of WB's answer to the MCU are more alive than ever, because Patty Jenkins didn't let them down.

 

I really liked this movie. If the movie stopped at the dance scene, I would've outright told you that it's easily one of the best superhero movies of all time. It gets a little troublesome from that point on, but overall, it's still supremely good and blows away all the nonsense that came before it from the franchise.

 

Okay, long list of positives first:

• Wonder Woman herself, and Gal Gadot as WW. There is, occasionally, that one bit of clunky line delievery that haunted Gal a little bit in Batman V Superman, but that is actually camouflaged brilliantly for the most part by a supremely charismatic and charming performance. Gal owns the role, bringing it the naivety, the curiosity, the strong beliefs and, of course, the badassness that Diana demands. And hot damn, Wonder Woman is such a great character. Not only insanely likeable (and sexy ), but truly a warrior who fights for what she believes in and doesn't take shit from anyone. She's easily the 2nd best thing to come out of the DCEU after BATFLECK;
• Patty Jenkins. She truly brings a wonderful (no pun intended) vision of WW to life, and her direction breathes life into the movie in a very unique way;
• Steve Trevor. More than just the romantic interest/sidekick of Diana's, this guy was another super likeable character. Helpful in the fights, a leader to his friends, smart, suave, pretty damn funny when needs to be, he was a really good character, and Chris Pine nailed it in the role;
• Gal and Pine's chemistry. So great it's worthy of its own section;
• All the other sidekick characters weren't really great or anything, but none of them was necessarily annoying, nor needless in the story as they all had their place in a natural way, and they had their charm and likeability too, so I was fine w/them;
• The action. HO. LY. SHIT. This is action done right. Yes, there are some quick cuts, and yes, if you're overly annoyed by slow mo, it's not gonna work for you that much (personally, I'm not the hugest fan, but it was totally done right for me in this movie). But, imo, this is some of the best action work in any superhero movie I've ever seen (and most movies I've seen in the last few years). Slick, stylish, brutal at points, and just awesomely satisfying. And since Wonder Woman kicking ass is a heavy component of the film, we get a lot of this, and it's absolutely fantastic. The No Man's Land sequence.... I got goosebumps running down my spine;
• On that note, the movie did a great job of jumping from the fantastically gorgeous Themyscira, to showing off the vile horrors of war in bone chilling grittiness and realism (and still merging the fantastical through Diana herself) remarkably naturally;
• On THAT note, my God was this movie beautifully shot - seriously, gorgeous from start to finish;
• The script was much stronger than any other DCEU movie so far. It balanced out the humor (which was actually fairly effective... pretty much anything w/Diana asking Steve about the warstruck world was comedy gold), the emotion and the action just fine, gave everyone something to do (w/perfectly reasonable motivations), and even the less good moments weren't necessarily poorly written (just not very exciting). Not to mention, while there is exposition rather often, the movie offers good justifications and scenarios for the exposition's existence, which was pretty neat.

Sadly, there are some issues I had w/the film that kept it from being GREAT:

• I wasn't a huge fan of the opening 5 minutes. I wouldn't call them BAD... let's just say that the movie only truly starts when Steve Trevor reaches Themyscira and the precedent felt like filler. There were obviously some working aspects (Themyscira's beauty, the collision of ideologies between Hippolyta and Antiope, the tale of Zeus and Ares), but it didn't quite click as a whole for me. Again, not bad, just a negative compared to what I consider a positive to be;
• No Man's Land was definitely a bit too high of a peak for most movies to reach, but it doesn't negate the fact that the movie does begin to fall a little flat from that point on, in terms of pacing/excitement, at the very least. After that insane adrenaline rush, the movie does begin to get a little too uninterestingly slow and shallow at parts;
• The CGI was more than a little questionable, to be honest, at least on the 3rd act;
• The villains. I mean, I don't think they were abhorrent or anything - far from being among the worst villains I've ever seen. Just that one was just same old evil Nazi (which always works, but still, same old), and the other was basically another Ultron/Ego type of "Humanity is awful, we need to destroy them before they destroy us". Neither of them was horrible, just nothing imaginative at all;
• The climax... that was a jarring change of tone. It was... pretty messy. To be fair, I wasn't abundantly annoyed by the Diana/Ares fight. David Thewlis was satisfyingly hammy, the action itself was alright for what it was, I cared about the hero, and again, the clash of ideologies between WW and Ares was impressively focused on, more so than the physical action (and I disagree w/Ares being Monologuing Doomsday - Doomsday was just an ugly LOTR troll who brought absolutely nothing but boring destruction for the sake of it, and its creation made zero sense; Ares at least looked cool and had a proper motivation). But, considering how restrained the action was in the movie, as well as its general tone, that felt a little odd to say the least. And the Ares revelation itself... meh. The poor CGI also doesn't help whatsoever.

So yeah, it does fall flat in its face w/these pieces of clunkyness. BUT, despite all of that, as well as the expected formulaicness (which didn't bother me too much as they knew how to keep it fresh - the WW1 setting and the double fish out of water story w/both Diana and Steve being the main reasons why), I really enjoyed the movie, and I recommend it to anyone who loves Wonder Woman, loves DC, comic book movies, action movies, and movies period.

 

A-

 

Batman V Superman: Dawn Of Justice (Theatrical cut) - C+

Man Of Steel - D+

Suicide Squad - D-

Edited June 1, 2017 by MCKillswitch123

[Nova]

This is a decent DCEU film but an extremely average movie. I was reading reviews about how great it is and how it's a breath of fresh air for the comic book genre but honestly it doesn't add anything to the comic book genre. This film had all the pieces to be a very good one but it just falls a part. It's your typical origin story which hey again there's no problem with that but when you continually hear "best comic book film" I'm sorry but I feel like I watched a completely different movie. Its not a master piece. It's not a fresh take on the genre. It doesn't add anything. It's formulaic. It's just there. There were some good and enjoyable moments in the film. I really enjoyed how well Gal and Chris got along together and you could truly feel their chemistry but to me that's not enough to save the film from just being a mediocre take on yet another origin story. Like I just can’t get around the tired formula, with its undercooked villains, third-act CGI monster, and utter wasting of a potential arch-nemesis who could have been compelling, given proper development and the latter is why this movie really falls apart for me. I don't want to use this word but this film is simply lazy. The first half of Wonder Woman feels interchangeable with Thor, the second half with Captain America: The First Avenger, and the character herself often feels like a mash-up of those two. Which again I'm not saying this makes the film "bad" but what I am saying is Wonder Woman is just about an average film. Now don't get me wrong this was definitely an improvement over BvS and SS but is it really up there with the best comic book films of all time? No. Is it up there with the other really good comic book films that have come out in recent years? I don't think so either. But the one thing Wonder Woman does do is it allows WB and DC to build the character from here. And I actually look forward to seeing Wonder Woman in a sequel and see where they take her character from here. 

 

 

Grade: C 

[Kalo]

Wonder Woman works where the other DCEU films failed by simply being a simple straightforward story, it is very lean, with a distinct beging, middle and end. I  completely disagree about the ending with most people, it was maybe one of the best parts of the movie and one of the best final acts in a Superhero film, this movie isn't without flaws, but there are so many things it gets so right that it almost doesn't matter. 

 

So I'll get what I didn't like out of the way, the film is quite long and does drag only slightly here and there. the slow mo is cool, part of the time, it is really overused by the end of the movie. Gal Gadot is really good- most of the movie, two of the villains are very cartoony- but they turn out to be side kicks to the real villain, who while pretty straightforward is a pretty intimidating villain imo. that's pretty much it.

 

The chemistry between Gal and Chris is off the charts in this movie, and every time the camera pulled away from them I just wanted it to go right back there, Chris Pine is abosutly fantastic in the movie- the romance story is possibly the best romance I've seen in a Superhero film, and one of my favorite things about this movie was how it doesn't mind slowing down and giving real intimate moments that actually make you care about the characters in the movies, there are several scenes like this and it works wonders, Patty Jenkins really excels in this aspect 

 

There are some scenes that are almost exactly like the First Captain America and I found that more funny then bad though, but they really should know to keep guys named Steve away planes with bombs in them at this point.

 

The score is amazing, Thysicara is really cool, and Robin Wright and Connie Nelson are both great in the limited time they are in the movie. 

 

This movie is really genuinely funny- not forced funny either. 

 

This movie feels like it could have been made 20 years ago, it's just really old fashioned in it's storytelling and I really appreciated that about it.

 

In the end it may not be the best superhero film ever made, and not everyone is gonna love, but I do think it will end up being one of my favorite SH films to date. this is so much better then the other DCEU films. I can't believe that we finally have a truly good movie from them and I'd like to thank everyone involved who know the best way to go was to stay true to the character. 

 

A 

[Sam]

Too lazy to write more detailed review so just copy/paste from the main spoiler thread

 

I liked it. Remind me quite a lot of the first Captain America. Guess I'm just a sucker for the heroic, passionate, old fashioned good-hearted characters.

 

Characterizations for Diana was pretty great. So was Steve Trevor and their relationship. But I thought the supporting cast weren't up to par, none were memorable for me (or at least none was memorable in good/non-ironic way) 

 

I only watched BvS once so I didn't really had much of an opinion on Gadot's limited appearance one way or another then. But I thought she was real neat in the role here. Acting/line delivering was spotty in parts but she really made up for it with the heart and sincerity that shined through. I looked forward to her character evolving and her getting more and more comfortable in the role. 

 

Actions were a bit dodgy, some very good, some pretty boring/repetitive. I used to be annoyed over the abusive use of slow-mo in action movies, but lately, such thing just made me numbed and bored. The set designs and staging was good though. 

 

Funnily enough, Wonder Woman was also similar to Captain America in how their origin movies were brought down by the third acts. Although, in completely different ways: Cap's 3rd act was too subdued and feel unfinished/cut abruptly short; while Wondy's 3rd act was excessive and noisy.

 

However, on the plus side, the 3rd act both contained some genuinely emotional high points of their respective movies.

 

Loved the underlying theme of hope and optimism (not so much 'underlying' since it's consistently presented for everyone to see but you get the point) 

 

Overall, for me, it's easily the most enjoyable offering of the DCEU. I'll definitely watch it one more time in theater. And looking forward to the sequel. 

 

B+

[Water Bottle]

Why the slow-mo? It's 2017.

 

Gal Gadot did a great job but Chris Pine was MVP. Like he's a big part of the reason I liked Wonder Woman. He really does have movie star charisma. I hope they find a way to bring him back to the DCEU: his presence is really needed.

 

This isn't me trying to take away from Gal Gadot's performance. Like I said, I think she did a great job.

 

B+

 

(Seriously slow-mo is a huge reason this movie isn't in A- territory)

[The Panda]

I thought this was really good.  Great even.  Theres some nitpicks I have, and it isn't a perfect movie, but whenever the movie made me start to question a decision something happened that immersed me back in and made me forget about my internal complaint (I constantly criticize movies in my head when I watch them.  I know I'm enjoying it when I'm engaged and forget about my complaints.)

 

I'll start with my few nitpicks

1. The villains always pulled me out, Gadot and Pine are just so compelling on screen that any scene without them falls flat.  Luckily there's very little of the movie without the two of them.

 

2. Ares was a little too hammy at parts, however I was fine with the cheesiness of his part, it made it fun.  I could have done with a little less "JOIN ME" monologues at the end, especially at the emotional climax.

 

3. It takes the film a bit to get going.  I enjoyed the beginning, but it wasn't as eye glueing as the rest of it.

 

4. Some of the transitions between scenes and moments are a tad jarring.

 

5. The third act is a little convoluted and could've used a bit more work.  But it's nothing like the third act messes of the other DCEU movies, it didn't detract much from the movie for me.

 

Onto the good parts

 

1. Gadot is stunning as Wonder Woman.  She's probably the most perfectly cast Superhero since Downey Jr as Iron Man.

 

2. Pine is also great in the movie.  And not just tentpole solid, I found him and Gadot to deliver really solid performances.  The best acting in a blockbuster since The Force Awakens

 

3. I loved the visual style, it was eye popping and exciting.  It's not bland and desaturated like most of the Marvel movies, and it's not overly grim and ugly like the other three DCEU films.  It was a striking balance.

 

4. THAT NO MAN'S LAND SEQUENCE

 

5. I loved the optimism of the movie, it was something that I haven't seen in a Superhero film since the original Spider-Man movies.  It also never came off as cheesy, simply sincere.

 

6. It has a lot of wit and humor to it, but not in a forced one liner way.  The humor feels natural, and it works well for that.  It doesn't suck you out of the movie, and it's not a "*wink* this is silly isn't it?" kind of humor.

 

7. I couldn't contrast this enough from the other DCEU films.  Everything they did wrong, this does right.

 

8. It just feels so refreshing.  So many of the tentpoles now feel so samey and formulaic.  And while this does follow the three act blockbuster structure, it does so in a way where you feel like you're watching something new (yet also warmly familiar).  It plays all of its beats really well.

 

9. The score is really strong, it's one of the better superhero scores.

 

10. There's so many honest and quiet moments that I thought really shined.  They let the characters take time to breathe, and those parts really worked.

 

11. Being self-contained and focused on the heroine really works well for it.

 

12. The messaging is realistic and hopeful.  There's also some great, inspirational hero lines in this movie that just give the more a hopeful tone to it all.  I wish Hollywood let their blockbusters have this outlook more often.

 

Overall, I really enjoyed this movie.  If I were to rank my favorite comic book movies this would easily make the top 10, probably even the top 5.  It leaves you wanting more and wanting to watch it again.

 

A

[fabiopazzo2]

7 is B or C+?  ... I don't know guys XD

[The Panda]

5 hours ago, fabiopazzo2 said:

7 is B or C+?  ... I don't know guys XD

 

I usually see 9 and 10 as A, 7 and 8 as B, 5 and 6 as C, 3 and 4 as D, ans 0 through 2 as an F

[fabiopazzo2]

6 minutes ago, Negative Panda Covfefe said:

 

I usually see 9 and 10 as A, 7 and 8 as B, 5 and 6 as C, 3 and 4 as D, ans 0 through 2 as an F

Thanx . 

[fabiopazzo2]

8 minutes ago, Negative Panda Covfefe said:

 

I usually see 9 and 10 as A, 7 and 8 as B, 5 and 6 as C, 3 and 4 as D, ans 0 through 2 as an F

I found this 

 

A: 90-99

B: 80-89

C: 70-79

D: 60-69

E/F: 0-59

is correct?

[The Panda]

1 minute ago, fabiopazzo2 said:

I found this 

 

A: 90-99

B: 80-89

C: 70-79

D: 60-69

E/F: 0-59

is correct?

 

It depends on how you personally want to do it.  That's usually the range for school grades.

 

Generallyc anything 6 or above is considered a positive review.

[fabiopazzo2]

5 minutes ago, Negative Panda Covfefe said:

 

It depends on how you personally want to do it.  That's usually the range for school grades.

 

Generallyc anything 6 or above is considered a positive review.

I found this on Wikipedia XD

[Ezen Baklattan]

Liked this a lot. I think it doesn't quite stick the last 30 minutes where it becomes more of a standard superhero movie, but the first 110 minutes were a razor sharp and truly uniquely crafted tale that feels perfect for the first female superhero movie. It really does dig at the nexus of hope and genuine emotion that lies at the heart of superhero movies but is often taken for granted, and the humanity of it all is truly splendid.

 

 

[fabiopazzo2]

7/10 

B-

[Plain Old Tele]

Wavering between an A- and a B+. I'll go with A- for now. Whatever quibbles I have are mostly muted by the strong emotional current throughout.

[TheMovieman]

Immensely enjoyed this. Gadot and Pine were perfection and the ragtag crew of theirs had some highlights as well. The finale did go down familiar territory but there was enough emotion to make me forgive it. As much as I enjoyed MOS and BvS, and to a lesser extent Suicide Squad, hopefully this bodes well for the future (will just have to see how much of an influence, writing wise, Joss Whedon has on Justice League).

But, Wonder Woman was fantastic. Bring on the sequel but please take the time to write a kick ass script. Will be hard to top Pine, however.

****¼/*****, (A-, 8.4/10, 3.25/4)