Fanboy Wars Thread: Personal Attacks not allowed | With Digital Fur Technology

[Cap]

13 minutes ago, dudalb said:

Exactly.though I think word you are looking for is deconstruction instead of disconnection.

Good old, autocorrect. Always there to make you look stupid. Lolol

[TMP]

Speaking of Watchmen... Lindelof's Watchmen is gonna be a masterpiece. Wonder when we'll get a full trailer. GoT finale?

[Napoleon]

Watchmen is the reality, plain and simple. The generic comic book movie full of color and happiness is an illusion. There's the dream world and there's the real world. If the dream world is your kind of thing, than good for you, no one's saying that's the wrong way. But why are you saying we can't have our way? That's the entire point. Some people are bothered that Zack Snyder wanted to make a realistic comic book movie. And the roots of that are the same as the hate against people with different religions. This people don't want us to have the option to see the real world. That's when you become wrong. You don't have the right to interfere in other people's rights, and that's exactly what they did to Zack Snyder's vision for the DCEU. No wonder almost all the bloggers who spread hate against him were caught in sexual assault and rape scandals...

[Plain Old Tele]

I'm so sorry you feel that reality is nothing but misery, brute force, and ugliness.

[Napoleon]

1 minute ago, Telemachos said:

I'm so sorry you feel that reality is nothing but misery, brute force, and ugliness.

That's one side of it, but BVS also has another side of it. That movie ends with hope.

[Plain Old Tele]

1 minute ago, Napoleon said:

That's one side of it, but BVS also has another side of it. That movie ends with hope.

 

Didn't it end with a pile of dirt?

[TMP]

Just now, Napoleon said:

Watchmen is the reality, plain and simple. The generic comic book movie full of color and happiness is an illusion. There's the dream world and there's the real world. If the dream world is your kind of thing, than good for you, no one's saying that's the wrong way. But why are you saying we can't have our way? That's the entire point. Some people are bothered that Zack Snyder wanted to make a realistic comic book movie. And the roots of that are the same as the hate against people with different religions. This people don't want us to have the option to see the real world. That's when you become wrong. You don't have the right to interfere in other people's rights, and that's exactly what they did to Zack Snyder's vision for the DCEU. No wonder almost all the bloggers who spread hate against him were caught in sexual assault and rape scandals...

Zack Snyder completely missed the mark on Watchmen. It's not "reality" when it fetishizes violence and uses slow-motion matrix-style action because it "looks cool" or whatever. Snyder's never made a film even close to set in reality, and he handles subject matter with the maturity of an emotionally stunted teenager.

There will be a good Watchmen adaptation (sequel?) this year though...

[Darth Lehnsherr]

It would have been interesting to see Snyder's vision go all the way through but at the same time WB shouldn't have expected Avengers level of success from these films which clearly they were judging by how they reacted after BvS. Radical reinterpretations of iconic characters isn't inherently wrong but you have to expect some backlash especially if you don't stick the execution. You could argue the same with Luke in TLJ. 

[2kt09]

4 hours ago, terrestrial said:

I guess you and me have very different POV about what very left-leaning is.

You are aware about what a lot of the US calls left is often considered right of the middle in Europe ?

 

Cameron 'lost' against Hurt Locker. I see no left POV in that movie.

 

E.G. Spotlight... where is there a left POV?

 

Birdman?

 

Oscar tends to give the Oscar to:

RL based material

Material, where the actors went through a big drama, suffered,... fought to their limits

Where they can see the effort in a way.

Sometimes a movie wins that has not by far a lot of #1 votes, but a lot of e..g. #2 votes. If the voters are split up about who should get the Oscar a lot of #1 votes get 'lost'

 

I do not really understand where the idea Hollywood is left comes from, yes, some actors speak out for themes counted as left (some of those are here again considered as right),... but there are also actors known to be supporters of the right or stay away from politics (the majority).

I thought it was merely a joke that the Ocars predominantly care for movies that stroke their ego - deal with filmmaking/characters trying to make it in Hollywood - and movies that come across as the most intersectional. 

2018's winner is about a gay black pianist journeying across Jim Crow era deep south with his white knight 

2017's winner is about a mute woman discovering beastiality, she's friends with a closeted transage and sassy black lady protecting this relationship from a military white guy 

2016's winner is about a gay black drug dealer's coming of age story

I for whatever reason thought 2015's winner was about the housing crisis, but it's really a bunch of journalists who specialize in pedophilia accounts in Catholic Churches 

2014 - "stroking their ego"

2013 - interectional period piece

2012 - "stroking their ego"

2 hours ago, captainwondyful said:

And, it is important to remember that watchmen is a disconstruction of the superhero genre. I always side eye people who say folks getting into comics should read Watchmen first.

 

Watchmen is something you build up to. 

As Nolan apparently told Snyder and Snyder elaborates for this Watchmen Q&A in which he brings up Batman, "Watchmen was a movie he did too early." IE at a time when the superhero movie genre wasn't as ubiqituous, so the relevant satire plastered throughout fly by. One of the obvious changes from source is when Ozymandias says "not a comic book villain" when in the book, the reference is "Republic Serial". For BvS, it's quite interestingly both a deconstruction and reconstruction.

Edited March 28, 2019 by 2kt09

[terrestrial]

3 minutes ago, 2kt09 said:

- snip - 

reread my description, inkl bio, drama, suffering....

 

That is, what they will pick.... out of, what they get offered as a ~ list to chose from.

bio over all (Green Book is biographical), drama / suffering over comedy.....

Something new, fresh, something that challenges an actor preferably.

 

Which stories film makers chose to film for which reason, audience,... is something else

[Matthew]

Here is what I think:

 

Imo  BvS damaged DC brand a lot. Many fans like me were highly Anticipating BvS. 

 

I booked 3 tickets for myself over the weekend. But only went on Thursday night. I was disappointed and can't fathom that Synder just blew up the franchise in matter of time. 

 

Whenever I think of BvS now, I genuinely feel sad. 

 

Synder don't respect comics like James Wan, James Gunn, Patty Jenkins, Russo Bros., Ryan Coogler. 

 

Yes, you can do innovative characterisation but you also have to respect comics. 

[dxmatrixdt]

6 hours ago, Barnack said:

I imagine you didn't read the left reaction to Green Book

 

King Speech

Artist

Argo

12 year's a slave

Birdman

Spotlight

Moonlight

Shape of Water

Green Book

 

Could you rank those movies by how political they were with which policy a government would be influenced to vote for or against if they would be influenced by them ?

 

I mean most of them do not feel 10% has political than something like Casablanca (that was giant propaganda) and some that can be seen has political like Spotlight are purely non partisan (I would imagine both left/right equally do not like Catholic church protecting priest and are both for good financed solid journalism).

 

1 - Spotlight (Mad Max, Revenant)

2 - Birdman (Selma, Theory of Everything)

3 - Shape of Water (The Post, 3 Billboards)

4 - Moonlight (Arrival, Hidden Figures)

5 - 12 Years A Slave (Her, Philomena, Gravity)

 

6 - Argo (Life of Pi, Silver Linings)

7 - Artist (Tree of Life, Extremely Loud...)

8 - Green Book (Favourite, Black Klansman, Star is Born, Roma, Vice)

9 - Kings Speech (Inception, Black Swan, Social Network)

[Porthos]

3 hours ago, captainwondyful said:

Good old, autocorrect. Always there to make you look stupid. Lolol

*getting back to your original point*

See, this is why I prefer decon/recon switches, myself (to use the TV Tropes term).

 

Yes, deconstructing things is fine.  But then turning around and reconstructing it in to something better/more relevant for the time is even better.

 

Anyone can be a cynic.  Many people can take things apart.  It's a true gift to be able to take something apart and then re-assemble it in a shape that LOOKS like the original and draws from the same themes as the original, but is better. Or at least more suited to the current times.

 

I think this is where Snyder fails for many.  He's good at taking things apart.  Not so good at reassembling them, at least for many. 

 

And I think part and parcel of it is this:  The people who are best at deconstructing things are the folks who really get the source material in the first place.  Alan Moore is many things, for instance.  Prideful and self-confident on the verge of arrogance to name two. But he intimately understands comics (esp Silver and Bronze age comics) which is why he was so good at making Watchmen in the first place.  Snyder, on the other hand, just doesn't seem to get what makes many versions of characters tick.  And, sure again, there have been many many MANY versions of Superman, Batman, et all.  

 

But Snyder seems weirdly hostile to the notion of comic book heroes in the first place.  And when you're coming at deconstruction from a point of anger and hostility as opposed to admiration and respect... Well, things can happen, as perhaps seen over the last few years in DC Land.

 

(NOTE: Just because one is coming from a position of love and admiration, doesn't mean your decon/recon story will necessarily go over very well with everyone.  As seen in my own particular fandom.  Cough. 😬)

 

Anywho, if Snyder works for you/someone, great!  I'm genuinely happy you have stories you enjoy.  Just... It's not exactly shocking to see that even to this day his statements rub some the wrong way.

Edited March 28, 2019 by Porthos

[Porthos]

10 minutes ago, Porthos said:

See, this is why I prefer decon/recon switches, myself (to use the TV Tropes term).

 

Yes, deconstructing things is fine.  But then turning around and reconstructing it in to something better/more relevant for the time is even better.

 

Anyone can be a cynic.  Many people can take things apart.  It's a true gift to be able to take something apart and then re-assemble it in a shape that LOOKS like the original and draws from the same themes as the original, but is better. Or at least more suited to the current times.

And if folks want an example, my go to one would probably be Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. In many ways it took apart and examined just what Gene Roddenberry's 24th century utopia would be like if a little bit of stress was applied to it.  In some cases, more than a little bit of stress. 

 

But, and this is the key point, it never* strayed too far from the core principles of Star Trek.  Ultimately it built toward affirming Roddenberry's legacy and saying "Yes, this is right. There will be pitfalls and setbacks (sometimes huge ones) along the way.  But ultimately we're on the same page philosophically." 

 

It's that last bit which is key, at least for me.

 

* Well, almost never.   And when taken in totality it didn't from where I sit.

[Matthew]

Brie Larson/Captain Marvel has suddenly become a big Lesbian Icon. 

 

 

 

Her fandom is far more active considering she is new to Blockbuster movie business. She is gaining a lot of support on social media. 

[Cap]

@Porthos 

 

Yes.  Yes.  

 

I think that's why Kevin Feige & Company succeed.  They do understand the core of the source material, and they understand how to adapt it for a modern audience.

 

I think Black Panther's M'Baku is an excellent example of Nate Moore, Ryan Coogler, and Joe Robert Cole of looking at what feels like a racist caricature from the comics, and finding a way to not only make that work, but make him so compelling.  They kept the spine: he's an antagonist for T'Challa, who questions of T'Challa runs Wakanda.  They keep some of the iconographies of the Apes.  And then they start to layer it with complex mythologies for the Jabari Tribe, and flesh him out as a real person.  Winston Duke did an excellent interview talking about the whole Jabari Tribe .

 

I also think this is why something like Dr. Strange or Iron First fails.  There was a resistance to listen to criticism with those productions.  And they did not re-invent or re-exam the problematic tropes.  So, it just turned into ... *waves hands toward whatever the first Dr. Strange movie was* Iron Man Redux.

[Cap]

22 minutes ago, Matthew said:

Brie Larson/Captain Marvel has suddenly become a big Lesbian Icon. 

 

 

 

Her fandom is far more active considering she is new to Blockbuster movie business. She is gaining a lot of support on social media. 

Of Course She Has!!!  Did you SEE THE MOVIE?  A Lesbian, Her Girlfriend, Her Bisexual BFF, Her Genderfluid [ Spoiler ], and her Trans Cat Saved The World from [ Spoiler ]'s Toxic Gaslighting.  I fucking wept in that theater.

Edited March 28, 2019 by captainwondyful
formatting glitch from hell

[TMP]

3 minutes ago, captainwondyful said:

Her Bisexual BFF

Give Nick Fury a boyfriend?

[Cap]

Just now, TMP said:

Give Nick Fury a boyfriend?

Coulson was RIGHT THERE.

[Porthos]

2 minutes ago, TMP said:

Give Nick Fury a boyfriend?

 

On 3/26/2019 at 4:09 PM, TalismanRing said:

How many of these did they do? I can't find the video for this one.

 

SLJ is a national treasure

 

Brie Larson and Samuel L. Jackson in Carpool Karaoke: The Series

 

 

 

 

Edited March 28, 2019 by Porthos