Birth of a Nation | Fox Searchlight | Sundance Grand Jury Prize. ONLY DISCUSS THE MOVIE AND BOX OFFICE IN THIS THREAD.

[filmlover]

I think the fact Parker has continued to have this "I'm the victim" attitude even after it was revealed that the real victim took her life is a sign that we aren't beating a dead horse. He's deserved all of the flack he's received.

[CoolioD1]

the entire press tour for this movie has been...

 

 

[Gumby]

Wow...

 

"But, you know, at some point I have to say it. You know, I was falsely accused. You know, I went to court. And I sat in trial. You know, I was vindicated. I was proven innocent. I was vindicated. And I feel terrible that this woman isn’t here. You know, I feel terrible that, you know, her family had to deal with that. But as I sit here, an apology is — no."

 

http://variety.com/2016/film/news/nate-parker-60-minutes-interview-rape-trial-birth-of-a-nation-1201875885/
 

[filmlover]

The total downward trajectory of this has to be one of the most fascinating movie-related stories ever.

 

January 2016: "The movie that will solve the Oscars' race problem!"

June 2016: "Looks like a surefire Oscar contender!"

August 2016: "Well, that escalated quickly!"

September 2016: "The movie that will forever change how studios pick up movies at the festivals due to background checks."

October 2016: "Nate Parker must have had the shortest career of anyone ever in the industry."

[That One Girl]

1 minute ago, filmlover said:

The total downward trajectory of this has to be one of the most fascinating movie-related stories ever.

 

January 2016: "The movie that will solve the Oscars' race problem!"

June 2016: "Looks like a surefire Oscar contender!"

August 2016: "Well, that escalated quickly!"

September 2016: "The movie that will forever change how studios pick up movies at the festivals due to background checks."

October 2016: "Nate Parker must have had the shortest career of anyone ever in the industry."

 

November 2016: "Birth of a Nation?  That 1915 film that changed film history yet was also racist?"

[TalismanRing]

4 minutes ago, Gumby said:

Wow...

 

"But, you know, at some point I have to say it. You know, I was falsely accused. You know, I went to court. And I sat in trial. You know, I was vindicated. I was proven innocent. I was vindicated. And I feel terrible that this woman isn’t here. You know, I feel terrible that, you know, her family had to deal with that. But as I sit here, an apology is — no."

 

http://variety.com/2016/film/news/nate-parker-60-minutes-interview-rape-trial-birth-of-a-nation-1201875885/
 

 

His reading of the justice system and what his verdict meant is erroneous. And his co-rapist (and co-writer) he invited in was found guilty. How they didn't charge him also as an Accessory and Instigator of Rape boggles. 

 

Regardless, so much for his new found understanding about toxic masculinity and consent that he was spouting off in that Ebony piece just a couple of weeks ago  I guess since that didn't garner him instant sympathy and forgiveness in the press or by the public so he's gone back to the old shtick - I'm a Christian. I have a wife and 5 daughters. I.. I... I...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[filmscholar]

Nate Parker had his day in court and was found innocent.  It's unfortunate what happen to the young lady but at the end of the day it was an accusation and that doesn't make it a fact.  He's been acting for 10 years and randomly a story that has not been hidden comes popping out of nowhere to try and destory this movie.  Why wasn't this an issue when he was acting in 10 previous movies?  Why now?  Could it be a smear campaign? Where was this story at Sundance?  Why did it come out 2 months before the movie opens?  

 

There are plenty of White Actors with horrible past that were actually found guilty and they get work and roles without anyone batting an eye.   I'm there opening weekend.  Nat Turner was written out of American History books for school because Slavery is completely glossed over and misrepresented to sugar coat the horror and terror this country caused Black people. Thankfully my parents gave me the real history at home.  

 

I don't need to go to the African American Museam in DC because I'm fully aware of the horrific treatment Black people faced in this contry for hundreds of years.   With all the police violence in the news it still continues.  There were TONS of Slave rebellions and it's about time to show that Black People were not "Happy Slaves" and that we fought back against racial terrorism.   Sadly because of this drama it's Oscar chances are probably done but it doesn't matter, as long as a new generation learns the truth that will mean more in the long run.  

Edited October 3, 2016 by filmscholar

[filmlover]

1 minute ago, filmscholar said:

Nate Parker had his day in court and was found innocent.   He's been acting for 10 years and randomly a story that has not been hidden comes popping out of nowhere to try and destory this movie.  Why wasn't this an issue when he was acting in 10 previous movies?  Why now?  Could it be a smear campaign? There are plenty of White Actors with horrible past that were actually found guily and they get work and roles without anyone batting an eye.   I'm there opening weekend.  Nat Turner was written out of American History books for school because Slavery is completely glossed over and misrepresented to sugar coat the horror and terror this country caused Black people.   Thankfully my parents gave me the real history at home.  I don't need to go to the African American Museam in DC because I'm fully aware of the horrific treatment Black people faced in this contry for hundreds of years.   With all the police violence in the news it still continues.  There were TONS of Slave rebellions and it's about time to show that Black People were not "Happy Slaves" and that we fought back against racial terrorism.   

He did an interview with one of the trades (I think it was Variety) two months ago (in which he brought his young daughter, obviously as a shield) to try and nip it all in the bud before someone else brought it up as a smear tactic. Just saying.

[TalismanRing]

He was found not guilty - not the same as innocent and so have lots and lots of rapists for totally fucked up reasons, that is even if the rape ever gets to the courts which happens for a minuscule % of those committed.  Even his co-rapist who was supposed to receive a minimum 3 years got a hand slap few months sentence because the School and it's Athletic Program sent in character letters for him as he and Parker stalked the victim on campus and Penn State turned a blind eye (and were later sued over and settled).  Then when the conviction was overturned the DA decided not to retry because other witnesses over the last 6 years had scattered, even though the victim was still willing to testify.

 

In this very interview Parker brings up his non guilty verdict as proof of his innocence while then saying that his co-defendant was erroneously convicted.  So I guess the court was only right in respect to him but not Celestine.  So the verdict only counts when it's in their favor, not against.

 

There is no conspiracy.  It was brought up now because Fox tried to do an end run against potential stories by bringing it up and having Parker do those interviews with Variety & Deadline.  It had been spoken of before in other interviews and articles but he wasn't important enough for too many too care. That he had no remorse, no compassion and no humanity shone through in those interviews (where he brought his 6 yr old daughter along as a flack jacket) and now after his short lived "wokeness" on rape and consent he's back to square one.  A man who believes he did nothing wrong.  A man who says that he hasn't thought of her or the rape  since. (even though now says he brought on Celestine years later as co-writer because he was wrongly convicted)

You can not promote a film while talking about morality and justice, and bring up how important the past is to the present and a people suffering from residual PTSD and not think your past as an accused rapist who's victim killed herself in part over the PTSD from that rape and the subsequent stalking and the lack of justice she received from Penn State and the Justice System is not relevant and will not be brought up and examined.

 

As for it's Oscar chances at a 7 avg and 82% rating on RT - it's critical ratings alone would bar it from main consideration.

 

In terms of the film being valuable - people can read a book, watch a documentary - because this is "based on" and some more major events have been changed or glossed over.  The insertion of a

Spoiler

rape as

catalyst is just one thing and the

Spoiler

not showing the killings of the rebellion

is the huge other.

Edited October 3, 2016 by TalismanRing

[Frozen]

25 minutes ago, filmscholar said:

Nate Parker had his day in court and was found innocent.  It's unfortunate what happen to the young lady but at the end of the day it was an accusation and that doesn't make it a fact.  He's been acting for 10 years and randomly a story that has not been hidden comes popping out of nowhere to try and destory this movie.  Why wasn't this an issue when he was acting in 10 previous movies?  Why now?  Could it be a smear campaign? Where was this story at Sundance?  Why did it come out 2 months before the movie opens?  

 

There are plenty of White Actors with horrible past that were actually found guilty and they get work and roles without anyone batting an eye.   I'm there opening weekend.  Nat Turner was written out of American History books for school because Slavery is completely glossed over and misrepresented to sugar coat the horror and terror this country caused Black people. Thankfully my parents gave me the real history at home.  

 

I don't need to go to the African American Museam in DC because I'm fully aware of the horrific treatment Black people faced in this contry for hundreds of years.   With all the police violence in the news it still continues.  There were TONS of Slave rebellions and it's about time to show that Black People were not "Happy Slaves" and that we fought back against racial terrorism.   Sadly because of this drama it's Oscar chances are probably done but it doesn't matter, as long as a new generation learns the truth that will mean more in the long run.  

 

The film is not historically correct. They changed Nat Turner's entire motivation for the rebellion. The real man saw himself as a solider of God and was inspired by a lunar eclipse that he saw as a sign. In this film he reacts to a fictional rape of his fictional wife, which is quite ironic.

[filmscholar]

14 minutes ago, Frozen said:

 

The film is not historically correct. They changed Nat Turner's entire motivation for the rebellion. The real man saw himself as a solider of God and was inspired by a lunar eclipse that he saw as a sign. In this film he reacts to a fictional rape of his fictional wife, which is quite ironic.

 

No Bio-picture in film history is 100% Historically accurate.  A film has to be dramatize so liberites are taken.   This is about getting the story out.  Obviously with information being more free in this era of time people will leave the movie and start to research the full story.   Most of all the slave stories hollywood releases we are rarely shown fighting back.   "12 Years" was fantastic though.   With that said I did think Steven did a fantastic job on "Amistad" showing the slave rebellion on the ship but then it turn into a courtroom drama.    Remember the orginal "Birth of the Nation" is one of the most racist film in history and was about stereotyping Black men raping white women so don't get me wrong, I get why the case is very ironic.  

 

As for "Rape" being in the film.  Slaves were raped regularly and constantly, that's History and he shouldn't sugarcoat it.   "12 Years" had a horrific rape scene in it as well.  I'm just skeptical of the timing of the story when Nate has been acting for so long.  It would one thing if this was his first movie.   Also I agree that Nate probably should of shown a little more remorse in interviews but the man was deemed innocent.  I realize our court systems are clearly not perfect but an accusation is just that.   Again the damage is done, there's no way it wins any Oscars. Someone brought the story out in a calculated way.  That's all.   As for Box Office, "Slave" stories don't really break the box office and it's not getting the most screens.  Luckly the budget was about 10 Million and they haven't spent too much on marketing so I'm hoping for 15-20 OW but again I can tell this story has derailed the film in so many ways.    

[RandomCat]

5 minutes ago, filmscholar said:

Someone brought the story out in a calculated way.  That's all.

That somebody being Fox and Nate Parker.

[Frozen]

12 minutes ago, filmscholar said:

 

No Bio-picture in film history is 100% Historically accurate.  A film has to be dramatize so liberites are taken.   This is about getting the story out.  Obviously with information being more free in this era of time people will leave the movie and start to research the full story.   Most of all the slave stories hollywood releases we are rarely shown fighting back.   "12 Years" was fantastic though.   With that said I did think Steven did a fantastic job on "Amistad" showing the slave rebellion on the ship but then it turn into a courtroom drama.    Remember the orginal "Birth of the Nation" is one of the most racist film in history and was about stereotyping Black men raping white women so don't get me wrong, I get why the case is very ironic.  

 

As for "Rape" being in the film.  Slaves were raped regularly and constantly, that's History and he shouldn't sugarcoat it.   "12 Years" had a horrific rape scene in it as well.  I'm just skeptical of the timing of the story when Nate has been acting for so long.  It would one thing if this was his first movie.   Also I agree that Nate probably should of shown a little more remorse in interviews but the man was deemed innocent.  I realize our court systems are clearly not perfect but an accusation is just that.   Again the damage is done, there's no way it wins any Oscars. Someone brought the story out in a calculated way.  That's all.   As for Box Office, "Slave" stories don't really break the box office and it's not getting the most screens.  Luckly the budget was about 10 Million and they haven't spent too much on marketing so I'm hoping for 15-20 OW but again I can tell this story has derailed the film in so many ways.    

 

It's one thing to take liberties, but they changed Nat Turner's entire motivation for the rebellion. And of course it was changed to rape so once again we can see how rape of a woman affects the men in her life and how they struggle with it. The focus isn't even on her, which doesn't shock me.

 

OJ was found innocent too. So what? The evidence suggests he is guilty 100%. I honestly do not care how it was brought up. He deserves it. 

[Arlborn]

I wonder when he himself will come out with the race card? Cause I sure have seen many of his defenders online saying people are only against him because of his color.

 

A rapist is a rapist no matter his color. Just remember that that same case would probably have gone different nowadays as society is a bit more clear on the consent bit, thank God. Still not clear enough though.

[BoxOfficeFangrl]

36 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

That somebody being Fox and Nate Parker.

Yep, Parker had a nice enough career before where his past wasn't overly questioned, but he had to reach for the glory and the brass ring. It's really all on him, the scrutiny he's facing now. Mostly on him, because the whole thing was on his Wikipedia page and briefly delved into in other profiles, so it should have made Fox Searchlight do a bit more research before handing over $17 million, to see it was not a simple he said, she said case and maybe this is not the guy you want to parade on the media circuit as the face of social justice. Still, BoaN probably could have been a major awards player anyway, if he'd just been an actor in it and someone else had written the script. Maybe Hollywood shouldn't have let Polanski skate for what he did* but two wrongs don't make a right and also AFIAK there wasn't some sex with an underage girl subplot in The Pianist serving as a reminder to everything.

 

*In a different time, it would play out very differently now I suspect, like how the Cosby allegations gained traction in 2015 though he'd been accused of the same behavior by multiple women in the aughts.

Edited October 3, 2016 by BoxOfficeChica

[Goffe]

3 hours ago, BoxOfficeChica said:

Maybe Hollywood shouldn't have let Polanski skate for what he did

 

Polanski hasn't done an American film since he fled the country

[WeneedtotalkaboutKevin]

OMG...at this point, a movie about the making of "birth of a nation" will be more interesting than "birth of a nation" itself. Given how Hollywood is working, years down the road, be prepared to see it at the theatre.   

[JennaJ]

8 hours ago, filmscholar said:

 

Someone brought the story out in a calculated way.  That's all.   

 

LOL at this conspiracy theory. Please. Nate Parker gave a couple of high profile interviews of his own (and Fox Searchlight's) initiative. That is what blew the lid on this. He tried to get a head start by giving the press the story in his own words, thinking it'll just blow over and be done with. He was wrong.

The reason it's exploding now is:

1. He's in the media spotlight, which he hasn't been as a low-profile actor up to now.

2. He foolishly decided to give interviews about this topic, before it was brought up by mainstream press.

 

The idea that this is some well-orchestrated attempt to kill his movie is so proposterous to me, I can't even believe people actually buy it. This isn't a witch hunt, it's karma.

 

Edited October 3, 2016 by JennaJ

[filmlover]

How long until someone trots out the "they're trying to take down a successful black man" angle? Worked so brilliantly for Cosby (*sarcasm*).

[BoxOfficeFangrl]

1 hour ago, filmlover said:

How long until someone trots out the "they're trying to take down a successful black man" angle? Worked so brilliantly for Cosby (*sarcasm*).

I think it's already been bandied about but it didn't really stick before. Thankfully this year all the black Oscar hopes are not wrapped up in BoaN...it's going to be difficult to peddle the "they just wanted to keep the black man down!" narrative should Denzel win his third Oscar in the same timeframe.