THE LITTLE MERMAID WEEKEND THREAD

[YM!]

In an unrelated note, it seems more and more likely Across the SpiderVerse is overperforming and likely to be a major smash for Sony Animation. Makes me wonder when they’ll do a slate update as they could easily build a brand for themselves. From the people who bought you “Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse” is a huge sell as the film is the 2010s version of Toy Story/Shrek. They have Fixed, K-Pop Demon Hunters and a bunch of originals in the wings and could be big theatrically. If I were Sony, I’d try to get the new Garfield movie by The Emperor’s New Groove people under the Sony Animation label next year even if the studio didn’t produce it (they did it for Goosebumps, Peter Rabbit and the Aardman movies). 

[Cmasterclay]

I do think the Disney brand is hurting worldwide a bit beyond the race stuff, probably in a way that it hasn't since 1989 when the first Little Mermaid dropped actually. Not fun times to be a legacy media brand, and no legacy media company relies on their brand like Disney does.

[Deathlife]

1 minute ago, Michael Gary Scott said:

Maybe people are just tired of live action remakes. Also when Disney put everything on D+ so fast it showed people they could just wait less than 2 months and it will be on their streaming service.

 

This is another issue with Disney.

 

When people are conditioned to watching stuff on TV as quickly as possible, folks just don't feel like going to the theatres. In my part of the world, going to theatres with kids is a A LOT of money. 

 

For Pixar (for example), I don't know how Disney is going to convince people to come back to the theatres to see those animated films. 

[Eric the IF]

8 minutes ago, Cmasterclay said:

Also to be clear I don't think audiences are "racist", just that as Charlie said there's less black audience in these places, just like how the non-Hispanic white numbers in America are also awful for alot of these films.

Yeah to clarify in my post, because I know it can be taken the wrong way, I do agree with you and don't think the underperformance for Mermaid OS is necessarily malicious intent (though it's definitely out there). But I do think it's at least unintentional racism, which is still racism at the end of the day. And it is true that these movies are hurt by the fact that many major markets don't have huge Black populations. But that's also a problem too, since people should be more willing to watch art and media made by and starring people who aren't from their cultural and racial background for a wide variety of reasons. And while it's getting a bit better, at least here in the US, we've got a long way to go.

[ogkalu]

1 minute ago, MovieMan89 said:

It could also have to do with domestic audience being where there is the most concentrated group of African descent peoples in any notable film market by a long shot. Therefore, it simply may not resonate as much in some markets, but doesn’t necessarily imply racism.  If anything, it shows how white beauty ideals have been pushed so hard by the likes of Hollywood for so long now as to be appealing in cultures where there aren’t really white people either.  That would probably be the case for black people too if mainstream Western media had perpetuated it for decades (and obviously why continued DEI in modern blockbusters is important). 

This is wayy overstating the black population in the US lol.

This isn't a movie that has anything to do with resonating with any race or culture. It's the little mermaid. There's no black culture, no african culture or whatever in prominent display. It's the little mermaid with the lead actress having a different skin color. That's it. 

 

[CJohn]

I feel like if you switch Halle with Zendaya numbers would be blowing up in Europe as well. There is a lack of a big name here for Europe, which is a very star driven continent. Asia I can't comment or else I get banned after the Transformers debacle.

 

Little Mermaid is just the same movie with a race bended lead. That has no effect on ticket sales. Only the most racist and extreme right people are complaining and won't go, but would those go in the first place? Everyone else couldn't care less. This isn't a Strange World situation here.

[MovieMan89]

8 minutes ago, Cmasterclay said:

Oh definitely. I think Charlie mostly nailed it, though I also think there's a contingent of (mostly white) liberals of other races in America who crossover unlike other places.

If anything, I would argue domestic is where the movie is getting hit the hardest by actual racism bc of the you know who groups of Americans today. 

[Cmasterclay]

Also not to pre-debate something three weeks in advance and off-topic, but I went to lunch with people today then saw some of my brother's friends. In both groups, the Flash came up, and several people brought up Ezra Miller and all the negative shit about him and not wanting to see the movie because of it. I have no reason to hate on that movie, given Sasha Calle is a former good friend of mine. I'm just saying. I think that story may be a little less online and a little more relevant than we thought. Just putting it out in the ether.

[BadOlCatSylvester]

Eh, I feel like the domestic skew will be worth it because of that sweet Black Panther money, which Disney will actually get to keep more of than overseas revenue. Just food for thought.

[MovieMan89]

6 minutes ago, ogkalu said:

This is wayy overstating the black population in the US lol.

This isn't a movie that has anything to do with resonating with any race or culture. It's the little mermaid. There's no black culture, no african culture or whatever in prominent display. It's the little mermaid with the lead actress having a different skin color. That's it. 

 

I think lots or domestic minorities have shown that they are committed to showing up for representation in blockbusters these days. It’s not about it having strong black culture, it’s about the fact that the community now has more representation in the Disney princess canon. Especially since it’s happening with who was already one of the most iconic and well known Disney princesses ever.
 

Little black girls can now say/feel things like “Ariel looks like me” etc, so I think that’s a draw for the community. 

 

Edited May 26, 2023 by MovieMan89

[baumer]

I know FX was expected to drop mightily this weekend but that 6 million dollar Friday looks kind of hilarious to me. And a 67% drop on a holiday weekend? That's just insane. It most certainly would have dropped north of 70% if Sunday wasn't heading into a holiday Monday.

[Eric the IF]

10 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

If anything, I would argue domestic is where the movie is getting hit the hardest by actual racism bc of the you know who groups of Americans today. 

See I actually do disagree with this. Movie audiences today have skewed more and more nonwhite and more towards urban/metropolitan markets, especially post-COVID. Top Gun 2's the exception, not the rule. So having Halle Bailey cast and nailing the part perfectly made this a Black Panther-style event. The audience that already go out for these remakes were already on board, but it also brought in a major audience sector who were excited they were being represented faithfully in a genre that was ignoring them since Princess and the Frog, which is almost 15 years old (That's such an insane fact lmao we're getting old).

 

Right-wingers who are all "Boycott Disney" were never going to see this if it starred a white girl, because they already barely go to the movies. And if Halle or Zendaya wasn't in here, then this movie would probably be grossing more around Maleficent numbers to account for remake fatigue/Disney+ factor (still good numbers!)

[Boxx93]

Princess and the Frog had a very good DOM/OS ratio (40/60) and that had a black female lead set in 1920s New Orleans.

 

I don't buy this narrative of TLM doing bad overseas because of racism.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Boxx93

[Krissykins]

Remember for a week or so people weren’t sure if GOTG3 would pass $300m. 

[MovieMan89]

4 minutes ago, Prince Eric said:

See I actually do disagree with this. Movie audiences today have skewed more and more nonwhite and more towards urban/metropolitan markets, especially post-COVID. Top Gun 2's the exception, not the rule. So having Halle Bailey cast and nailing the part perfectly made this a Black Panther-style event. The audience that already go out for these remakes were already on board, but it also brought in a major audience sector who were excited they were being represented faithfully in a genre that was ignoring them since Princess and the Frog, which is almost 15 years old (That's such an insane fact lmao we're getting old).

 

Right-wingers who are all "Boycott Disney" were never going to see this if it starred a white girl, because they already barely go to the movies. And if Halle or Zendaya wasn't in here, then this movie would probably be grossing more around Maleficent numbers to account for remake fatigue/Disney+ factor.

Yes, I get your point here. I just meant where there is likely a good amount of actual hateful racism regarding this movie is domestically. Whether those people would have seen it with a white girl or not. 
 

I also think the domestic non-minority audience that aren’t racist like that are very excited about Halle’s casting  as well. 

Edited May 26, 2023 by MovieMan89

[BadOlCatSylvester]

1 minute ago, MovieMan89 said:

I think lots or domestic minorities have shown that they are committed to showing up for representation in blockbusters these days. It’s not about it having strong black culture, it’s about the fact that the community now has more representation in the Disney princess canon. Especially since it’s happening with who was already one of the most iconic and well known Disney princesses ever.
 

Little black girls can now say/feel things like “Ariel looks like me” etc, so I think that’s a draw for the community. 

 

Bingo. Representation isn't always reliable as we've seen with Strange World, but when attached to a high profile release it can make your movie much more relevant then it otherwise might've. Black Panther proved that, and to a more grounded extent so will this movie. It is worth noting thought that it is very much an American thing still, as overseas audiences simply don't prioritize it the way American minorities do. There is a little racism there, but it is largely simply cultural differences. There's no need to overcomplicate this really.

[JohnCarterofEarth]

Don’t studios get a larger share of the gross in the domestic market than the foreign market? 

[wildphantom]

14 minutes ago, Deathlife said:

 

This is another issue with Disney.

 

When people are conditioned to watching stuff on TV as quickly as possible, folks just don't feel like going to the theatres. In my part of the world, going to theatres with kids is a A LOT of money. 

 

For Pixar (for example), I don't know how Disney is going to convince people to come back to the theatres to see those animated films. 

Easy. By not putting them free on tv weeks after they’ve opened 

[Eric the IF]

2 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

Yes, I get your point here. I just meant where there is likely a good amount of actual hateful racism regarding this movie is domestically. Whether those people would have seen it with a white girl or not. 
 

I also think the domestic non-minority audience that aren’t racist like that are very excited about Halle’s casting  as well. 

Oh I see. Misunderstood your post. And yeah, I also think Halle's casting is also a big draw for white guys like me. I'm tired of these stupid remakes like everybody else, and I'm already planning to catch it later this week because I love Halle and her music and want to support her from all the backlash against her. I would have skipped this otherwise if Ariel was white.

[KP1025]

47 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

It’s the only Renaissance film to get its own land in a Disney park in Tokyo… I feel like it’s had to have been pretty popular in Japan at least for that. 

 

Aladdin has its own land at Tokyo DisneySea too. Tokyo Disneyland also added a Beauty and the Beast land a few years ago (though technically that one is a subsection of Fantasyland if we're splitting hairs).