China Box Office Thread | Oppenheimer-August 30

[Ariana]

4 hours ago, FantasticBeasts said:

China is the biggest overseas country guys. I am sure Disney won't b happy with the performance of Rogue One. Not only for the number itself but because it kind of shows that SW may never reach the heights of TFA again in a market that there was already a ton of room for growth

SW is OK obviously. It could be OK with North America alone. But it is my opinion that SW8 will show a respectable drop from TFA. I wouldn't call 1.5b an easy goal at all.

TFA may have been a huge succes in the short-run but in the long run, it may have done some  harm for the SW franchise. At least in some countries. 

But on the other hand, I believe it was inevitable. Those countries were never into Star Wars. I bet a lot of people hadn't seen a single SW movie until TFA. It wouldn't have been easy task to gain them.

That's not the case in Asia only. I grew up in europe and I can tell you that during my adolescence there were very few guys from my age that had seen the SW movies. Like very very few. We knew star wars just from the toys.. It's not like all european countries are all in for SW. There are a lot of countries were it did from OK to not-so-good business.

 

Yeah, for Disney it won't be "just China", excuse me, "just China"??? It's the second biggest film market and a soon-to-be biggest market of the world. Disney has tried everything possible to save SW's future box office and merchandising in China with a desperate attempt, and it's very clear that they don't plan to give up at all. China is a promising market and Chinese moviegoers are easy to please, they just want to be entertained by an audience-friendly, creative movie with a decent plot and acting, it's not that hard, actually it's not a problem at all. They never reject and harass the new stuffs, then force the studio to make nostalgic films and call it "loyal to the original" like US fanboys. That fanboy's belief is so twisted and weird. I never imagined that SW brand would suffer this fate. but unfortunately, thank to TFA and SW fanboy, SW lost the chance.

Edited January 9, 2017 by Ariana

[George Parr]

51 minutes ago, Ariana said:

 

Yeah, for Disney it won't be "just China", excuse me, "just China"??? It's the second biggest film market and a soon-to-be biggest market of the world. Disney has tried everything possible to save SW's future box office and merchandising in China with a desperate attempt, and it's very clear that they don't plan to give up at all. China is a promising market and Chinese moviegoers are easy to please, they just want to be entertained by an audience-friendly, creative movie with a decent plot and acting, it's not that hard, actually it's not a problem at all. They never reject and harass the new stuffs, then force the studio to make nostalgic films and call it "loyal to the original" like US fanboys. That fanboy's belief is so twisted and weird. I never imagined that SW brand would suffer this fate. but unfortunately, thank to TFA and SW fanboy, SW lost the chance.

 

China is not "soon to be the biggest market in the world", not by a longshot. The market didn't improve in 2016 at all, and the only reason it didn't drop significantly is because the first three months were still huge.

 

And who said anything about "just China"?

Nothing like that can be found in the post you quoted.

 

What you don't seem to get, is that a Hollywoodf studio is not going to cater to one specific area in the hope that they will be more sucessful there, when the price is risking the rest of the world. Star Wars has plenty of territories where it is incredibly huge. In fact, it is so huge that it managed to break a billion internationally even with China being lackluster. They aren't going to throw everything a franchise stands for -  a franchise that has been among the most successful ever worldwide for almost four decades now - out of the window, in the vague hope that markets that haven't shown much interest so far suddenly "get it". Star Wars is the biggest franchise in the biggest market. It's also the biggest or one of the biggest franchises in many of the largest intenational markets. What you are saying amounts to me suggesting Chinese movies should drop everything they are known for to accomodate my tastes. And that would obviously be nonsense, because I'm not the audience China is producing movies for.

 

And to top things off: just because you see nothing but "nostalgia" being used doesn't make it somehow the truth. Both TFA and Rogue One have been extremely well received, and while TFA isn't exactly big on creativity, focusing more on delivering everything people connected to Star Wars in the past, Rogue One can hardly be blamed for the same thing. It's also kind of odd to criticise a lack of creativity or to ask for "just a decent plot and acting", when most of the most successful American movies in China were all of the "mindless fun with not a whole lot of plot or particularly noteworthy acting" category.

[Agafin]

@Ariana Are you for real? There is absolutely no reason for Disney to pander to China more than they have already done from a capitalist point of view. At the end of the day, they just have to accept that Star Wars is not for everyone and move along, there's nothing wrong with that.

 

Disney probably got more money from TFA in each one of The UK, Germany, Japan, France and Australia so it doesn't make sense to make some drastic change to the universe to appease to China if it has any chance of adversely affecting the movie's performance in NA or one of the aforementioned markets.

 

And China won't be biggest BO market anytime soon, if ever, if you actually follow the trends. I'd say that we're in for a drop in total BO this year even.

 

[terrestrial]

1 hour ago, PPZVGOS said:

Good, I came in here to post the same link, but knew someone else probably already did it for me. 

Well, that article from CFI, 100% confirms what I have been saying on this as well as on a Star Wars forum, about how many people perceive this franchise in non-Anglophone countries and especially in places like China, East Asia in general and Lat-Am. 

First of all, the dialogue sounds bizarre, clumsy and even nonsensical to many non-English speakers. Second, the context is simply not known or understood. Third, there's a perceived lack of action for many foreign audiences. 

Also, Chinese audiences were very pleased with Yen and Wen, but were not happy to see them die (again, lack of context awareness) 

If I were Kathleen Kennedy, I would focus primarily on pleasing my core, vast, and super-lucrative Anglophone audience, then maybe the Euro-audience, and the rest of the world may have the time to decide if they are to like Star Wars or not. 

 

 

Quote

Lingering negativity from The Force Awakens seems to have contributed to the box office drop and the majority of walk-ins seduced by Yen and Jiang’s inclusion were similarly confused by Rogue One’s character relationships and bored with its story.

“The first three-quarters of Rogue One were filled with perplexing dialogue and an overall sluggish plot,” wrote the most-liked, one-star user review on Maoyan, where general audiences have given Rogue One a weak 7.9/10 rating, even lower than The Force Awakens’ 8.2. “During my screening, some people were scrolling through their WeChat feeds. Some were playing games, and still others were sleeping. The sounds of snoring that filled the theater were more thrilling than the movie itself. The ending was baffling.”

 

Soso, they cite the most liked one star review (singular!!!), but nothing else. Written in an outlet... not known for being balanced. And that you think is proof for also being so generalizing judgemental? As far as users write here, not the GA is, that rates and writes there. Is that not longer true for only one film out of one franchise?

It gives no examples... sounds to me like a typical fanboy (of the anti-I-am-cool-nature) whatever. Where is pro and contra? Rhetorical question.

 

I read what you wrote here at BOT in different threads. This 'article' does not confirm '100%' of what you spread, aeh said there.

[terrestrial]

I have no problem with not liking parts or all of the film, but why not say:

I didn't like it for this and that reason.

 

Suggestion:

use not an over-dramatic / exaggeratedly / too absolute .... style to write and reason, then there is a chance of being there a basis to discus instead of to diss, like it feels to me, what some here (and elsewhere) write.

E.g.:

List the most often named critique points (ranking included would be helpful), with additional input about who (e.g. age-gender-urban-something group) and ~ how many said so about which critique point, but also the pro parts. Balanced.

 

E.g. SW 7 = old-fashioned designs and not impressive to boring fight scenes (or was that about the old ones, if yes, it should be defined as such, like: SW 7 had better fight scenes than.... but was still too.... whatever.) seem to have number one and two, missing backstory,... lets say place 3. 

Like e.g. missing back-story a lot said, but ranked it as not so bad point, middle important point, very important  point. Said by the young male teens, the adults, the... whoever it was.

Finn might be on place ??? for age-group/fandom group/ other reasons... whatever for this and that reasons. 

Also: was there a sound difference between the English original version and the Chinese version, see heavy breathing? Is heavy breathing a cultural no-no? Why do people even speak about heavy breathing of a non-soldier running through unused to hot environments and so on.

 

Then there seem to be part of the audience do not like this or that.

When the balanced people write here, they never wrote 'all'... they differentiate = makes them in my point of view respectable mature discussion partners, I take them in earnest. 

 

Speak about how the GA reacted to the probably not ideal title, how was the translation, any input about other mistakes,... like including the strange release date row in relation to the time-line... into promo-material or whatever was missing in the Chinese market.

 

Differences in country-side and urban audience reactions.... ?

What said people who liked it or who like only a part of it about the positive aspects?

Why do people e.g. stanning for Rey with who-ever? Is that an important point, that in films boy-meets-girl parts have to be included? That is e.g. something that I personally found baffling to read.

And... whatever someone feels should be brought out, preferable in a mature, constructive way, so people can get new impressions, can learn about another POV without getting ... negative feelings.

As said, only a suggestion....

[Olive]

MONDAY ESTIMATES
Rogue One - ￥24M /236M(-60% drop ,EP7 -65%)
Some Like It Hot - ￥15.8M/382M
Railroad Tigers - ￥6.9M/609M
The Great Wall - ￥4.05M/￥1109M 
Hacksaw Ridge - ￥1.83M/￥394M 
See You Tomorrow - ￥1.45M/469M
Nerve - ￥1.1M/8.3M

 

[druv10]

Looks like very good Monday drop for RO, 24M+(sub 60%). WOM so far seems good.

Edited January 9, 2017 by druv10

[MonstersandRoy]

2 hours ago, Ariana said:

 

Yeah, for Disney it won't be "just China", excuse me, "just China"??? It's the second biggest film market and a soon-to-be biggest market of the world. Disney has tried everything possible to save SW's future box office and merchandising in China with a desperate attempt, and it's very clear that they don't plan to give up at all. China is a promising market and Chinese moviegoers are easy to please, they just want to be entertained by an audience-friendly, creative movie with a decent plot and acting, it's not that hard, actually it's not a problem at all. They never reject and harass the new stuffs, then force the studio to make nostalgic films and call it "loyal to the original" like US fanboys. That fanboy's belief is so twisted and weird. I never imagined that SW brand would suffer this fate. but unfortunately, thank to TFA and SW fanboy, SW lost the chance.

 

Star Wars has spent most of it's 40 year existence being huge without grosses or high grosses from China, so I'm sure it will be just fine. Big grosses from China would have been great, a bonus, but I think Star Wars has just arrived their too late. It's first wide Star Wars release after all was the 7th film in a series, a series that follows a long overall storyline.

Edited January 9, 2017 by MonstersandRoy

[titanic2187]

in fact, china is not the only one country that not fond of SW, same goes to taiwan, south korea, india....just the china number is too big to ignore, Maybe SW is too "western"

[PPZVGOS]

2 hours ago, terrestrial said:

 

 

 

Soso, they cite the most liked one star review (singular!!!), but nothing else. Written in an outlet... not known for being balanced. And that you think is proof for also being so generalizing judgemental? As far as users write here, not the GA is, that rates and writes there. Is that not longer true for only one film out of one franchise?

It gives no examples... sounds to me like a typical fanboy (of the anti-I-am-cool-nature) whatever. Where is pro and contra? Rhetorical question.

 

I read what you wrote here at BOT in different threads. This 'article' does not confirm '100%' of what you spread, aeh said there.

 

All the circumstantial evidence seems to be supportive of my line of argument. 

 

That review was characteristic of the general reaction to Rogue One in China, the BO results seem to confirm as much. 

[PPZVGOS]

6 minutes ago, titanic2187 said:

in fact, china is not the only one country that not fond of SW, same goes to taiwan, south korea, india....just the china number is too big to ignore, Maybe SW is too "western"

 

Star Wars is "too Anglo" for most of the planet. It simply can't translate very well into other languages. That's my main theory. 

[FantasticBeasts]

I think both sides are kind of wrong. The truth is in between. No, SW's underperformance is not somethng that should have Disney experts really worried. Overall SW is still the most successful franchise right now even without the help from Asia. They would make a lot of money with usa and 2-3 more countries alone.

On the other hand, it would be unwise from Disney to say that we are just fine.  There is always room from growth. And they did understand this. Do you really believe that the casting of 2 chinese actors was just because they were the better of the candidates? They obviously tried to improve SW numbers in Asia. It just didn't work and If that didn't work I don't think that there is anything that can help. Disney should just accept that in Asia, SW is not very popular.

RO's performance in Asia and LA is not something that Disney can be happy of. But still, the overall performance of the film was very impressive driven by USA and it didn't really need those counntries.

[terrestrial]

14 minutes ago, PPZVGOS said:

All the circumstantial evidence seems to be supportive of my line of argument. 

That review was characteristic of the general reaction to Rogue One in China, the BO results seem to confirm as much. 

Only if ignoring all other statements made by other Chinese or connected to China/Chinese people here.

 

It is not about that those points never were made, it is about that also other points were made, and those other points seem to be ranking higher than the points you try to imply as more or less sole points or #1 point.

 

Btw, that was not a review... see It gives no examples... sounds to me like a typical fanboy (of the anti-I-am-cool-nature) whatever. Where is pro and contra?

I'd expect more from one of my pupils, even the younger / 7th grader ones, something like that would get an 'F'. Earnestly.

[terrestrial]

Quote

...Star Wars spin-off Rogue One: A Star Wars Story debuted on top of the... (Jan 2-8), taking in $30.72m from its three-day opening weekend.

.... its takings represented around 61% of Star Wars: The Force Awakens two-day opening weekend in 2015, but was on par with Star Trek Beyond’s three-day opening weekend last year.

To draw the Chinese crowd, the new film has roped in local cast such as Ip Man action star Donnie Yen and renowned director-actor Jiang Wen.

....Some Like It Hot w... $27.97m for $53.04 after 10 days.

...Railroad Tigers ... $16.09m. .... $87.25m after 17 days,....

.The Great Wall s... $11.16m for $160m after 24 days.

See You Tomorrow, .... $5.22m. With a 17-day total of $67.68m, ...

Last week’s box office was down by approximately 24%. This week’s new releases include Passengers, Kubo And The Two Strings and Eye In The Sky, all scheduled for Jan 13.

For dollar amounts...

http://www.screendaily.com/screenasia/rogue-one-debuts-on-top-of-the-chinese-box-office/5112621.article?blocktitle=LATEST-FILM-NEWS-HEADLINES&contentID=44435

[nVIDIADriver]

3 hours ago, MonstersandRoy said:

 

Star Wars has spent most of it's 40 year existence being huge without grosses or high grosses from China, so I'm sure it will be just fine. Big grosses from China would have been great, a bonus, but I think Star Wars has just arrived their too late. It's first wide Star Wars release after all was the 7th film in a series, a series that follows a long overall storyline.

I totally agree with you.

 

 

[RobinHood26]

You guys are tripping. You assume Star Wars must be the biggest franchise everywhere, it doesn't. TFA did fine, it did pretty good/standard big budget hollywood gross in china, in line with most big franchises. Tell me again how thats bad?

 

Also a country that supposedly doesn't like Star Wars, didn't like TFA, and yet Rogue One a full stand alone confusing Spin off to a country that didn't have the OT in there blood or have the film this is the prequel to released in its country and its going to do about 50% of what TFA did which is about in line with the  rest of the world's drop, so Im not sure why people are shocked or upset. 

 

 

 

I'd also like to point out for months we heard TFA wont hit 100m in China. It did easily. And for the last few weeks all we heard was Rogue one would be lucky to hit 45m in China. It will come close to 60. 

 

Its doing just fine.

Edited January 9, 2017 by Jay Hollywood

[nVIDIADriver]

2 hours ago, FantasticBeasts said:

I think both sides are kind of wrong. The truth is in between. No, SW's underperformance is not somethng that should have Disney experts really worried. Overall SW is still the most successful franchise right now even without the help from Asia. They would make a lot of money with usa and 2-3 more countries alone.

On the other hand, it would be unwise from Disney to say that we are just fine.  There is always room from growth. And they did understand this. Do you really believe that the casting of 2 chinese actors was just because they were the better of the candidates? They obviously tried to improve SW numbers in Asia. It just didn't work and If that didn't work I don't think that there is anything that can help. Disney should just accept that in Asia, SW is not very popular.

RO's performance in Asia and LA is not something that Disney can be happy of. But still, the overall performance of the film was very impressive driven by USA and it didn't really need those counntries.

 

This is what I want to say, the contributions of China and some Asian countries are not that importance for SW films. Of course, Disney should find a proper way to seek a breakthrough but it's unnecessary to conclude that SW is hopeless or will be overtaken easily by many other competitors in the near future.

[terrestrial]

4 minutes ago, Jay Hollywood said:

You guys are tripping. You assume Star Wars must be the biggest franchise everywhere, it doesn't. TFA did fine, it did pretty good/standard big budget hollywood gross in china, in line with most big franchises. Tell me again how thats bad?

Also a country that supposedly doesn't like Star Wars, didn't like TFA, and yet Rogue One a full stand alone confusing Spin off to a country that didn't have the OT in there blood or have the film this is the prequel to released in its country and its going to do about 50% of what TFA did which is about in line with the  rest of the world's drop, so Im not sure why people are shocked or upset. 

I'd also like to point out for months we heard TFA wont hit 100m in China. It did easily. And for the last few weeks all we heard was Rogue one would be lucky to hit 45m in China. It will come close to 60. 

Its doing just fine.

 

That is one of the points I do not understand also. It behaves not really in another way than all other countries including the 'better' dropping ones., for now even better than most of the Asian markets... Let's say it makes $60m (not sure about that), SW 7 made acc. BOM $124.159m. As far as I know the exchange rate fell a bit. So lets say it makes around half of SW 7 considering the exchange rate. Aaaannnnddddd? There will be countries wher it will make maybe something around 25% of SW 7.

 

 

 

Only to be sure:

the points I made are not even about one dollar it made more or less (I take BO always as they happen, no strong feelings ever about money made), I am majorly 'disputing' the generalizing of certain reasons as major/sole reasons, when others, especially more balanced appearing writer, give a list of reasons, that seems to rank the reasons in another way in addition. 

The style, and the lopsidedness. Nothing has ever only one reason.

[CaptainJackSparrow]

So did The Great Wall do good here??

[nVIDIADriver]

15 minutes ago, CaptainJackSparrow said:

So did The Great Wall do good here??

Not good but at least better than expected.