Avatar: The Way of Water | 16 DEC 2022 | Don't worry guys, critics like it

[IronJimbo]

20 hours ago, interiorgatordecorator said:

 

I'd be slightly annoyed if avatar 2s box office potential could be mostly explained away due to economics, the box office benefit of a weakened dollar should be the cherry on top of a historic box office run. I don't think Id be totally satisfied with anything under the first ones numbers when adjusted for 2019 exchange rates. 

This is just the way of things and it always has been. Titanics box office run was more 'impressive' for its time than Avatar, but the climate was completely different.

The more I look at box office, the more it seems pointless to compare films outside of different eras and landscapes.

 

We've entered into a complete new era now. Pandemic causing a decline in Cinema attendance, meanwhile the global ecomony getting screwed.

 

I used to be hyped of the prospect of Avatar 2 getting 4 billies, but now what does that even mean in the new climate compared to the past. All I know is that Avatar 2 will be extreemely popular and the saga will become bigger than Star Wars and pound for pound the biggest franchise in existance, that can generate the most hype and excitement around a single film.

 

Avatar 2 could have made SIX goddamn billies if we continued the 2014->2018 trajectory again from 2018->2022. It would have left a giant gulf between #1 and #2, just as Avatar and Titanic did before it.
 

[Issac Newton]

On 4/12/2022 at 8:12 PM, KnucklesXXR said:

unlike some of the numbers you were mentioning a few months ago.

 

Do not say it again 🙂

Spoiler

Because I have changed/moved to reality 😬

 

[dudalb]

On 4/12/2022 at 3:05 AM, Elessar said:

The market is pretty volatile at the moment so long term predictions can be a bit of a crapshoot. What's the economy gonna be? COVID could have some serious ramifications especially in markets like China. Maybe it would have been better to delay Avatar 2 another year... 😐

You could say that about any big blockbuster.

I don't even think Covid will be the major cause of instablity. We, it should be clear, are in a new Cold War, and that will have box office impacts. We have already seen on major market basicaly vanish, And the China market exists on the whims of a dictator, and if relations between China and the West worsen Xi could take it out on Western media in China.

[WittyUsername]

9 minutes ago, dudalb said:

You could say that about any big blockbuster.

I don't even think Covid will be the major cause of instablity. We, it should be clear, are in a new Cold War, and that will have box office impacts. We have already seen on major market basicaly vanish, And the China market exists on the whims of a dictator, and if relations between China and the West worsen Xi could take it out on Western media in China.

You sure do love making cynical outlooks on a movie’s box office potential based off world events…

[interiorgatordecorator]

Ruble seems to have recovered most of the value its lost due to the wars outbreak, assuming the conflict ended before july, any chance western companies start returning? Or are movie distributors going to be sanctioned if they try?

Edited April 13, 2022 by interiorgatordecorator

[Issac Newton]

6 hours ago, WittyUsername said:

You sure do love making cynical outlooks on a movie’s box office potential based off world events…

I believe they need to visit a doctor. Despite of having a different forum "Politics", they are printing their views/frustrations on Movies.

 

[interiorgatordecorator]

 

and Avatar 2 is also garnering enough interest even eight months before its release to give its opening weekend and total box office predictions a bump up.

 

A long way off of being a realistic prediction, but it increased a bit

[hw64]

11 minutes ago, interiorgatordecorator said:

and Avatar 2 is also garnering enough interest even eight months before its release to give its opening weekend and total box office predictions a bump up.

 

A long way off of being a realistic prediction, but it increased a bit

 

Wonder what audience interest metrics they're tracking.

[Royce]

From my observation, everyone who is underestimating Avatar 2's potential gross just assumes that the movie itself will just be the same old same old

 

And we who have been following every news article about this movie know that this is not the case

The new technology will recreate the "never done before, never seen before" novelty factor that made the first one THE must-see cinematic event of the 2000s

 

Can't wait to see how the characters will interact underwater in an alien planet's ocean with the new technology. Just trying to imagine it is already exciting.

[MadGoose]

Just imagining what the Na'Vis themselves will look like considering how insanely great they looked in 2009 is really exciting. I feel like this will melt our brains. 

[AniNate]

I'm not getting my hopes up in that regard, the 2009 renderings remain pretty innovative and I don't know how much one could realistically improve on that from an audience aesthetic perspective.

 

I'm assuming the focus will have been more on getting them to work underwater and other general environmental function improvements.

Edited April 15, 2022 by AniNate

[IronJimbo]

1 hour ago, MadGoose said:

Just imagining what the Na'Vis themselves will look like considering how insanely great they looked in 2009 is really exciting. I feel like this will melt our brains. 

Goodness me its going to be nutty.

 

Avatar at it's time was what 10 years ahead of its time in terms of CGI? Hell it still has better CGI than loads of blockbusters.

 

Avatar 2 is going to allow us to see what other movies will look like in 2035.

[IronJimbo]

1 hour ago, AniNate said:

I'm not getting my hopes up in that regard, the 2009 renderings remain pretty innovative and I don't know how much one could realistically improve on that from an audience aesthetic perspective.

 

I'm assuming the focus will have been more on getting them to work underwater and other general environmental function improvements.

 

Just looking at Avatar itself, you could actually see how much more they could have improved it back in 2009 if they had more time. Different scenes were done by different companies I believe and this one here is one the best.

If you compare this to something else, which was closer to the average quality of CGI in the movie, you can see that there is massive difference in aesthetics and render quality.

 

My point is that Avatar at the time wasn't even close to it's maximium potential. If all shots in Avatar 2 were to the quality of the first image shown, it would be a MASSIVE improvement on the 1st film.

The thing is, the first image above is going to be the baseline in Avatar 2, and there will be shots which look even better. Scary.

Also Avatar 2 will be in 4k too, which Avatar wasn't.

[hw64]

50 minutes ago, IronJimbo said:

 

Just looking at Avatar itself, you could actually see how much more they could have improved it back in 2009 if they had more time. Different scenes were done by different companies I believe and this one here is one the best.

 

If you compare this to something else, which was closer to the average quality of CGI in the movie, you can see that there is massive difference in aesthetics and render quality.

 

Yeah, a lot of people seem to forget that Avatar had a very tight post-production schedule for what it was trying to achieve — they were really down to the wire in terms of delivering the completed film on time, and they even had to bring on other VFX studios like ILM to finish some of the non-Na'vi shots like the ships and the mechs in the final battle. And the whole process of creating and delivering the visual effects was a huge learning experience, so the Na'vi visual effects shots that WETA was delivering at the end of post-production were huge improvements on the visual effects that they'd delivered at the beginning of post-production.

 

Avatar 2 has had much more time to perfect its visual effects, especially with the extra year that the COVID delay allowed. With that in mind, and given the general advancements in tech over the past decade, the shots of Neytiri behind the tree during the final battle in Avatar should be around equal to the absolute worst Na'vi CGI we see in Avatar 2. And while Avatar was impressively consistent in its CGI given the ambition of the film, there are still certain shots that weren't as well done as the rest, so Avatar 2's CGI should be a noticeably more consistent package.

[Deuce66]

2 hours ago, IronJimbo said:

 

Just looking at Avatar itself, you could actually see how much more they could have improved it back in 2009 if they had more time. Different scenes were done by different companies I believe and this one here is one the best.

If you compare this to something else, which was closer to the average quality of CGI in the movie, you can see that there is massive difference in aesthetics and render quality.

 

My point is that Avatar at the time wasn't even close to it's maximium potential. If all shots in Avatar 2 were to the quality of the first image shown, it would be a MASSIVE improvement on the 1st film.

The thing is, the first image above is going to be the baseline in Avatar 2, and there will be shots which look even better. Scary.

Also Avatar 2 will be in 4k too, which Avatar wasn't.

 

The first image is what they called "a million dollar shot", there are scattered scenes throughout the movie with this quality, the Tsu'tey death scene included in the expanded version of the movie is one example. I expect Avatar 2 to completely blur the lines between full CGI characters/live actors interacting together, their environments and presented in full clarity (no muddy darkness to hide or mask lazy/cheap CGI). Although we know darn well that the Na'vi & Pandora aren't real, they will look 100% real. 

 

Looking over the full cast & crew listing at IMDB, it appears that Weta is the only digital effects provider working in tandem with Lightstorm. This is a great sign imo as Weta does amazing work and like Jim they're a company that is always innovating and pushing forward. 

 

Avatar 2 - Full Cast & Crew (IMDB) 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1630029/fullcredits/?ref_=tt_cl_sm

 

 

Not the best quality upload on YT but you get the idea. 

 

 

 

[Lothar]

12 hours ago, Deuce66 said:

 

The first image is what they called "a million dollar shot", there are scattered scenes throughout the movie with this quality, the Tsu'tey death scene included in the expanded version of the movie is one example. I expect Avatar 2 to completely blur the lines between full CGI characters/live actors interacting together, their environments and presented in full clarity (no muddy darkness to hide or mask lazy/cheap CGI). Although we know darn well that the Na'vi & Pandora aren't real, they will look 100% real. 

 

Looking over the full cast & crew listing at IMDB, it appears that Weta is the only digital effects provider working in tandem with Lightstorm. This is a great sign imo as Weta does amazing work and like Jim they're a company that is always innovating and pushing forward. 

 

Avatar 2 - Full Cast & Crew (IMDB) 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1630029/fullcredits/?ref_=tt_cl_sm

 

 

Not the best quality upload on YT but you get the idea. 

 

 

 

Start one is one of my fav scenes.

[TomCruiseTop]

On 4/15/2022 at 10:24 AM, AniNate said:

I'm not getting my hopes up in that regard, the 2009 renderings remain pretty innovative and I don't know how much one could realistically improve on that from an audience aesthetic perspective.

The reason you can't see that is the same reason you're not the one currently slaving away in NZ and instead posting on BOT. That's not me trying to be cruel, it's just that is the nature of innovators and genius.

[dudalb]

On 4/13/2022 at 2:42 PM, WittyUsername said:

You sure do love making cynical outlooks on a movie’s box office potential based off world events…

This comment was not aimed at this specific film but at the film market in genera.

And you call it cynical, I call it realistic; box office will be chaotic for a while.

For the record, i think A2 will be a big hit, though maybe not as big as some wold have it.

[dudalb]

On 4/15/2022 at 4:59 AM, hw64 said:

 

Yeah, a lot of people seem to forget that Avatar had a very tight post-production schedule for what it was trying to achieve — they were really down to the wire in terms of delivering the completed film on time, and they even had to bring on other VFX studios like ILM to finish some of the non-Na'vi shots like the ships and the mechs in the final battle. And the whole process of creating and delivering the visual effects was a huge learning experience, so the Na'vi visual effects shots that WETA was delivering at the end of post-production were huge improvements on the visual effects that they'd delivered at the beginning of post-production.

 

Avatar 2 has had much more time to perfect its visual effects, especially with the extra year that the COVID delay allowed. With that in mind, and given the general advancements in tech over the past decade, the shots of Neytiri behind the tree during the final battle in Avatar should be around equal to the absolute worst Na'vi CGI we see in Avatar 2. And while Avatar was impressively consistent in its CGI given the ambition of the film, there are still certain shots that weren't as well done as the rest, so Avatar 2's CGI should be a noticeably more consistent package.

What I want to know is will the script be better then first film.

[Wormow]

To be fair, there's quite a bit of hype for this movie despite no marketing or anything this far out.... perhaps the extended wait between movie 1 and 2 has helped the "curiosity" factor build back up. Everyone wants to see if this will truly be amazing.