American Sniper (2014)

[Hatebox]

Tempted to see this just to find out whether it really is the military fetish movie a lot of people have suggested. Eastwood's style is so detached it's hard to imagine the movie taking much of a stance either way, but after his Talk To The Chair debacle perhaps his critics couldn't help but see him in a right wing light and view this movie accordingly.

[riczhang]

I know its fucked up, and most likely true. Why else would anyone want to join the marines or become a sniper, because they like the weather in afghan?

 

Ehhh..... I feel like sometimes I was born into the wrong century, but there is still a concept called 'Serving your nation' and joining 'For Queen and Country' and 'For King and Empire.' I think it's perfectly acceptable explanation for the people in the army and in the civil service. Otherwise, why would you ever want to dedicate your life to hardship (physically and metaphorically) for paltry pay? 

 

If you were talking about an executioner, I would agree with you and say that they probably joined because they get off on killing people, but I think that for you to reduce the want to join the armed forces to 'getting off on killing' is frankly not only rude, but inaccurate and kinda demeaning to the people who do choose that job. I'm not a great proponent of militarism or war by any means and I think that war, whenever undertaken, should only be as an absolute last resort in the protection and/or promotion of the direct self-interest of a country. But at the end of the day, these are still men and women who risk their lives out there at least nominally in the name of their Country and for a just cause and the least we can do is not write them off and call them psychopaths. It's the decent, moral human thing to do. 

[boomboom234]

I know its fucked up, and most likely true. Why else would anyone want to join the marines or become a sniper, because they like the weather in afghan?

This is offensive 

[boomboom234]

Give me a break , is that what you got from my reply ? Hell I don't even consider Alexander the Great "great" . The American army is almost in every country these days so of course it will be judged differently from other armies .

As for the "you are not in his shoes" argument you can excuse every kind of criminal with this . A serial killer is a madman ,"you are not in his shoes so don't judge " , a guy that walks into a school and kills women and children the same , you can excuse any form of crime with this line of thinking .

As far as wars go,I never consider members of an occupation force "heroes" , they are just mercenaries in my book . If Eastwood had the balls he would have made the real story of this guy into a movie but of course then people will have hated it and no big b.o numbers .

Again after movies like "apocalypse now" and "platoon" this movie looks like a sick joke .

I don't know what Alexander has to do with anything he was referred to as great as in the world that he lived in where strength was everything and the only thing he proved himself the strongest and best. But on war some people still believe in serving one's country and doing ones part that's not what everyone's reason is but regardless these people are willingly giving up their lives to serve us and deserve respect. There is a reason why this movie connects to people as people are tired of the same constant message that war is hell that vietnam movies parrot out ad nauseum. Iraq is not Vietnam and this movie is not even pro war it offers both perspectives one through Chris one through his brother and squad mate. What crime is being referred to Chris never committed a crime he was a soldier he did what he had to do to protect his guys and I applaud him for it. Btw Platoon is an incredibly overrated movie probably the worst of the famous vietnam movies

[Lordmandeep]

Ehhh..... I feel like sometimes I was born into the wrong century, but there is still a concept called 'Serving your nation' and joining 'For Queen and Country' and 'For King and Empire.' I think it's perfectly acceptable explanation for the people in the army and in the civil service. Otherwise, why would you ever want to dedicate your life to hardship (physically and metaphorically) for paltry pay? 

 

If you were talking about an executioner, I would agree with you and say that they probably joined because they get off on killing people, but I think that for you to reduce the want to join the armed forces to 'getting off on killing' is frankly not only rude, but inaccurate and kinda demeaning to the people who do choose that job. I'm not a great proponent of militarism or war by any means and I think that war, whenever undertaken, should only be as an absolute last resort in the protection and/or promotion of the direct self-interest of a country. But at the end of the day, these are still men and women who risk their lives out there at least nominally in the name of their Country and for a just cause and the least we can do is not write them off and call them psychopaths. It's the decent, moral human thing to do. 

 

 

Yes the famous command from Lord Nelson at Trafalgar 

"England expects that every man will do his duty" 

 

Such attitudes and opinions are foreign to us now, as we live in much easier comfortable times especially here in the West.

The number of users here who will suffer through war or participate in it would be quite small today.

However go back to WW2 or Napoleonic times, more then half of us on here would be serving. 

 

I think people forget that modern times people are far more individualistic and selfish (not saying its bad).

 

People in the past were more collectivist and were used to being ordered around.

Edited January 20, 2015 by Lordmandeep

[DAR]

Actually from what I've read of Clint he's been against every war since Korea

[luna]

jessie's comment about military psychopaths is probably the only true thing he's ever said, though for completely wrong reasons. and for every crazy person who loves killing people, there are another ten that think killing people, whilst not enjoyable, is honourable in the name of sucking up to your precious little nation-state.

 

i'm going to see this just to see how fucking awful it is.

[Lordmandeep]

Oh Yes Lisa is part the "Nation States are bad" group. 

[Ozymandias]

jessie's comment about military psychopaths is probably the only true thing he's ever said, though for completely wrong reasons. and for every crazy person who loves killing people, there are another ten that think killing people, whilst not enjoyable, is honourable in the name of sucking up to your precious little nation-state.

 

i'm going to see this just to see how fucking awful it is.

 

Hopefully its higher than your 1.5/10 Boyhood score.

[Gopher]

baumer loving this is the least surprising thing ever

[boomboom234]

jessie's comment about military psychopaths is probably the only true thing he's ever said, though for completely wrong reasons. and for every crazy person who loves killing people, there are another ten that think killing people, whilst not enjoyable, is honourable in the name of sucking up to your precious little nation-state.

 

i'm going to see this just to see how fucking awful it is.

It is honorable. My nation state as you put it is my family my friends my culture my life. My country is what allowed me to become who I am giving me opportunities and a life. killing if necessary to defend all that you know and love is honorable. Evil does exist in this world and people exist whose only wish is to destroy my way of life and culture and killing these people is a necessary task. When bin laden died what did you do.

[luna]

killing if necessary to defend all that you know and love is honorable. Evil does exist in this world and people exist whose only wish is to destroy my way of life and culture and killing these people is a necessary task.

good lord.

Edited January 20, 2015 by lisa

[riczhang]

Yes the famous command from Lord Nelson at Trafalgar 

"England expects that every man will do his duty" 

 

Such attitudes and opinions are foreign to us now, as we live in much easier comfortable times especially here in the West.

The number of users here who will suffer through war or participate in it would be quite small today.

However go back to WW2 or Napoleonic times, more then half of us on here would be serving. 

 

I think people forget that modern times people are far more individualistic and selfish (not saying its bad).

 

People in the past were more collectivist and were used to being ordered around.

 

 

I love that quote. At one point, I had a very large scale model of Victory flying that in my study. Moved it out since because it clashed with the new modern, sleek minimalist theme at my new place. 

[baumer]

baumer loving this is the least surprising thing ever

 

I don't understand what this means.  Is this some kind of backhanded stab at me?  Am I not supposed to like it? 

[riczhang]

I don't understand what this means.  Is this some kind of backhanded stab at me?  Am I not supposed to like it? 

 

It's just seemed like a typical Baumer movie I guess.... 

[Lordmandeep]

I love that quote. At one point, I had a very large scale model of Victory flying that in my study. Moved it out since because it clashed with the new modern, sleek minimalist theme at my new place. 

 

Its a great quote because its not an inspirational speech.

 

It was simply stating that there is an expectation of a person in the Royal Navy to fight and die for your country and King. 

 

It quite nicely sums up the different attitudes people have towards things then and now. 

 

I would also add, that people who fought for such purposes did not really see the "monarchy" or their nation state as something to protect.

 

It was much more local, it was defending home or that idealized version of home. 

[baumer]

It's just seemed like a typical Baumer movie I guess.... 

 

I don't think there is a typical baumer movie.  My taste in film is just as eclectic as anyone's.  I liked Amour just as much as you did and I liked Twilight and Transformers.  I like all kinds of movies.  And when you say it's a baumer type movie, it sounds like you are saying it's not a great film and I shouldn't be enjoying it.  A+ cinemascore, Oscar nominated and critical acclaim.  Did I miss the memo where it says that it's a shit movie?

[luna]

some people like this quite a lot.

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2015/01/16/american-sniper-review-a-patriotic-pro-war-on-terror-masterpiece/

[Kvikk Lunsj]

Ehhh..... I feel like sometimes I was born into the wrong century, but there is still a concept called 'Serving your nation' and joining 'For Queen and Country' and 'For King and Empire.' I think it's perfectly acceptable explanation for the people in the army and in the civil service. Otherwise, why would you ever want to dedicate your life to hardship (physically and metaphorically) for paltry pay? 

 

If you were talking about an executioner, I would agree with you and say that they probably joined because they get off on killing people, but I think that for you to reduce the want to join the armed forces to 'getting off on killing' is frankly not only rude, but inaccurate and kinda demeaning to the people who do choose that job. I'm not a great proponent of militarism or war by any means and I think that war, whenever undertaken, should only be as an absolute last resort in the protection and/or promotion of the direct self-interest of a country. But at the end of the day, these are still men and women who risk their lives out there at least nominally in the name of their Country and for a just cause and the least we can do is not write them off and call them psychopaths. It's the decent, moral human thing to do. 

I never spoken to anyone who joined the military to kill someone. Most have other reason of joining such as family honor, wanting to go to college. the need of discipline, ect. Plus the army does some good in the world  for instance is the US military was deployed to nations that had the ebloa outbreak to help out.  

[riczhang]

I don't think there is a typical baumer movie.  My taste in film is just as eclectic as anyone's.  I liked Amour just as much as you did and I liked Twilight and Transformers.  I like all kinds of movies.  And when you say it's a baumer type movie, it sounds like you are saying it's not a great film and I shouldn't be enjoying it.  A+ cinemascore, Oscar nominated and critical acclaim.  Did I miss the memo where it says that it's a shit movie?

 

 

No, no-one is saying that it isn't a great film and for the record, I loved it as much as most people and it's 3rd on my list of BP nominees. (Though I wouldn't say Critical Acclaim. It's in the 70s on RT which isn't really that great) I think that there is just a conception (or misconception) that Baumer likes populist films more than the average BO forums member? And American Sniper is an extremely Populist film. 

Edited January 20, 2015 by riczhang