WEEKEND THREAD: Lightyear implodes with 51M DOM, 85.6M WW. THE LAST PIXAR MOVIE EVER?????😱😱😱 | Dominion #1 with 58.66M, Top Gun 44M

[CoolioD1]

2 minutes ago, Ipickthiswhiterose said:

 

It's a film with a talking cat and yet it's closer to Solaris, Ad Astra and Moon than any other films you'd ever see with a talking cat. 

 

please don't get me interested in this film when i've already committed to not watching it.

[PlatnumRoyce]

 tk

Edited June 17, 2022 by PlatnumRoyce
tk

[ThomasNicole]

5 minutes ago, Ipickthiswhiterose said:

It is one of the most tonally bizarre films I've ever seen.

 

It's a film with a talking cat and yet it's closer to Solaris, Ad Astra and Moon than any other films you'd ever see with a talking cat. 

 

Sure, some of these are Sci-Fi themes, but geez, they needed to be tempered with some actual fun. This is a miserable, dank film.

Well i'm more interested now after this description.

[grey ghost]

50% of Boomers support gay marriage but 74% of millenials.

 

You can imagine where generation Z will stand.

 

Disney is betting their chips on the youth. And if you look at the content of Disney Plus it's not hard to figure out why.

[ZeeSoh]

6 minutes ago, Yandereprime101189 said:

I've been thinking Pixar's been in a rut since Monsters University and Cars 2. Brave and Up were the last two really good original story films they made to me

Their run up until Toy Story 3, reception wise, was incredible with only Cars 1 being not very highly rated. But since then they have been somewhat hit and miss. The period from 2011 (Cars 2) till 2017 (Cars 3) was their worst. The only great movie in there being Inside Out. But since then they seem to have turned it around and all their movies from Coco onwards have been highly to very highly rated. Lightyear unfortunately has bucked that trend but I hope it is a one off. 

 

Pixar is at their best when they are making original movies. It is no surprise that during their bad period (2011-2017), 4 out of 7 movies were sequels and spin offs. 

[Ipickthiswhiterose]

10 minutes ago, CoolioD1 said:

please don't get me interested in this film when i've already committed to not watching it.

 

 

I should have added "an not in a good way"....to that.

 

That said I wouldn't be surprised if there are some who would have dismissed this film who actually like it. 

 

But it's not "If A24 did a Pixar sci fi film" so much as "if A24 did a Pixar sci fi film and a member of the Cars division of Pixar head office kept an eye on it the entire time to make sure it still fulfilled the requisite brief"

 

It's not that it's actively *bad*. I mean, it is in places. I would hope this is the moment everyone realises that for all his skills as a director Taika Waititi is a highly niche actor who is abysmal outside of VERY specific kinds of projects but if that didn't happen after Jojo Rabbit, Free Guy and The Suicide Squad I don't know that it's gong to happen. He is horrendous in this.

[BruiseCruise]

Pretty neat that Will Smith and Tom Cruise both get their first $1bil films in the last couple of years. Only Denzel, Bullock and Hanks left of the A1 movie star list

[Juan Caballo]

5 minutes ago, krla said:

Turning Red seemed a lot more controversial than LY, at least with parts of the US. 

I can't remember any Disney films where kissing scenes were highlighted in the media (maybe older ones like Snow White). I'd imagine many parents are going to think the movie is more sexual than it is, and most parents and children don't want to watch sexual movies together. 

 

The problem with female 'protagonists' these days are that they are written like villains. Your average protagonist has certain paths; they will fail at things, they will overcome them, they have some moral system that places an internal barrier on their strength. Many of these things are stereotypically associated with feminine traits; compassion, empathy, emotions, weakness, dependence on others, etc. Stereotypical male traits, like strength, violence, independence, confidence, are seen as 'good'. So crappy writers think "huh, if I want a strong, independent female character, I'll just erase ALL those stereotypical female traits, and give them ALL those stereotypical male traits". But what makes a hero in modern cinema is a character with both. Even greatly written villains, like the Joker, have traits of both. But poorly written villains just have those 'male' traits. They have strength, independence, aren't emotional, no empathy. 

 

So a lot a female protagonists today are poorly written villains, and we're expected to celebrate them. But there's no real connection when you can't identify at all with a character. There's no struggle, there's no growth, there's no moral lesson. It's just a woman smashing stuff, which is basically what poorly written heroes 50+ years ago were like. But the softer traits that humanize heroes are what have made characters popular. 

 

You don't see people hating Ripley from Alien the same way they do with many female leads today. And the primary difference is that female characters are poorly written.  

I

Toy Story films brought in billions in merch for each film. I think number 3 brought in over $10 billion. Slapping this film in theaters helps to raise its profile, and when it goes to Disney+, it'll hopefully work as a toy ad for Disney. Though it may not be quite the toy ad as the Toy Story films. But if it brings in a couple billion from merch, I won't be surprised if we see sequels, and potentially an expansion into Woody and other character films.

A few years back when Last Man Standing was cancelled (despite it being like the number one show on w/e network) I remember a lot of people being surprised by this, and then thinking it must be because of Tim's politics (I think this happened right around the Roseanne cancellation, too?). Which is funny, because Roseanne and LMS have always seemed like shows that have conservative characters who become a little more progressive each week. I've always been surprised conservatives love these shows and liberals hate them.

 

But anyways, I think the knowledge of Tim's politics and him not jiving with Hollywood is well known. Throw in the recent kerfuffle with Disney getting a bit more politic (and the drama over them saying they are inserting LGBTQ+ stuff in films) and I can imagine that the average conservative is aware of this. 

 

Disney gets the left by default. They have to work to get the right. And it seems they have little interest in pursuing the right, especially with the explicit statements from employees saying they are putting LGBTQ+ stuff in everything. But I suspect their box office will suffer. Conservatives are more likely to have kids, and more kids, than liberals. So they've made it clear they aren't targeting families anymore. And another little thing that many people don't talk about; minorities are far more socially conservative than white conservatives. They go to church more, they are against gay marriage, they are against LGBTQ+, at the highest rates. Though they tend to be more pro-choice. Young families are half minorities these days, with much of the rest being white conservatives. Anyways, I suspect we'll see Lightyear's demos being predominantly white, and not as many families. This could be the new reality for Disney. For films targeting teen audiences and above, they don't really have to worry about what parents think. But for films where parents are the ones deciding the movie, they are going to have a larger hill to climb. 

 

If Disney wants to keep pushing LGBTQ so blatantly (and I don't mind), I think they need a complete shift towards adult audiences and more mature content. Start making darker versions of the fairytale films. Grow up with the audience. 

I agree with some of the things you say here. 

 

Disney is choosing political sides. And leaving the other totally aside...looking at it in a business perspective, I think will result in diminishing returns because you're excluding a huge audience. I don't think that's a good idea. Specially now that it seems that like you said, Disney is making it in almost every single project. 

 

Toy Story movies were in times where Disney still had the good will of both sides. And now it doesn't. At all. And I think we're already seeing in Lightyear. 

 

And I think studios like Pixar and WDAS will suffer the most because they are the most Disney branded studios and the ones conservatives will probably distance themselves completely. Unlike a Marvel Studios. 

 

 

 

 

[Alex SciChannel]

2 minutes ago, BruiseCruise said:

Pretty neat that Will Smith and Tom Cruise both get their first $1bil films in the last couple of years. Only Denzel, Bullock and Hanks left of the A1 movie star list

Doesn't Hanks have Toy Story 3 & 4?

[Yandereprime101189]

It really doesn't help Disney's animated front that Strange World looks really, really lame and is basically kinda Lightyear 2.0 - space explorers stranded on a strange world likely looking for a way out. For a movie with that title, you'd expect the aliens to be wild, inventive and strange . . .and they just look like plush child bath toys, which might be the point. They need their Froz3n or Big Hero 7.

Edited June 17, 2022 by Yandereprime101189

[Alex SciChannel]

Just now, Yandereprime101189 said:

It really doesn't help Disney's animated front that Strange World looks really, really lame and is basically kinda Lightyear 2.0. For a movie with that title, you'd expect the aliens to be wild, inventive and strange . . .and they just look like plush child bath toys, which might be the point. They need their Frozen 3 or Big Hero 7.

I may be biased but as a stem major that's in Paleozoology, the conceptual megafauna in this fictional biodiverse world looks incredible.

[Yandereprime101189]

3 minutes ago, Alex SciChannel said:

I may be biased but as a stem major that's in Paleozoology, the conceptual megafauna in this fictional biodiverse world looks incredible.

 

Yeah, but a lot looks like leftover ideas from that Discovery Channel The Future is Wild special.

 

I do sincerely hope I'm wrong. But this looks like a major downgrade from Encanto.

[grey ghost]

22 minutes ago, grey ghost said:

What are the top animated movie opening weekends from the pandemic era?

 

Lightyear - ???

Encanto - 27m

Bad Guys - 23m

Sing 2 - 22m

Boss Baby 2 - 16m

 

Maybe animated movies aren't ready for 75+m openings anymore.

 

I guess we'll learn more with Minions 2.

[Ipickthiswhiterose]

24 minutes ago, krla said:

Turning Red seemed a lot more controversial than LY, at least with parts of the US

 

Even if this was hypothetically true (I'm not sure and am not in the US) Turning Red I think would simply have done better due to much stronger word of mouth, positive vibes and a lot of identification with the characters and themes. And also, as intangible as it is, that it is simply a considerably better film in use about every way.

 

25 minutes ago, krla said:

I'd imagine many parents are going to think the movie is more sexual than it is

 

I think this is a pretty good point actually. I'm distanced from culture wars in many ways, especially those of the US and the idea anything in this film was anything other than milquetoast and is actually risqué in any way is bizarre. To be honest outside of Sox, the main character involved was the best in the film and her (brief) romantic story one of the few engaging things in it. 

 

26 minutes ago, krla said:

Which is funny, because Roseanne and LMS have always seemed like shows that have conservative characters who become a little more progressive each week. I've always been surprised conservatives love these shows and liberals hate them.

 

But anyways, I think the knowledge of Tim's politics and him not jiving with Hollywood is well known.

 

Fair.

 

I think it would have been expedient to be clear about Allen's connections to Santa Clause 3 and being clear about his place in Disney. I also think it would have been fun to commission Pixar's first live action film about a prima donna actor Chris Evans who refuses to do voiceovers for toys and plucky unemployed voiceover artist Tim Allen who fills in and they solve a toyline related crime together with hilarious consequences. That would have really staved off any aggro. And been a far more fun film than Lightyear.

 

 

25 minutes ago, krla said:

You don't see people hating Ripley from Alien the same way they do with many female leads today. And the primary difference is that female characters are poorly written. 

 

Hmmmmmmmm.

 

I think some of the female character issues have merits - Charlie's Angels being a good example where good, well defined characters at the start of the film became weirdly homogenised in a 'you can do anything' motif. HOWEVER I think it's massive overstated and comes with these rather unfortunate perennial caveat examples of Ripley, Sarah Connor and Princess Leia.

 

Thing is, Ripley and Connor come from horror-aligned genres which is the one area where there has been a template historically for male viewership engaging with female characters - for the simple fact that corporeal threat is universal and non-gendered. Yes men can empathise with Laurie Strode or Sidney Prescott not wanting to get stabbed to death, or Sarah and Riply not wanting to be mutilated or eaten, but that's not engaging with any of their experience as women. 

 

Leia on the other hand is, in the original trilogy, a main character but not a figure of identification. Luke is the specific solitary over-the-shoulder figure in the Star Wars OT.

 

I think male empathy with female characters IS an important development at the moment: and usually if people play the Ripley/SarahConnor/Leia game with me I acknowledge that some of their critique of contemporary female 'hero' characters might be correct but challenge them instead to name 5 good female characters *from outside of horror or horror-aligned films* that *they directly relate to the experiences of when watching the film* before proffering them mine.

 

 

 

 

[Mr Terrific]

I’m a liberal with some serious hostility toward conservatives BUT I give conservatives a wee bit more credit than some do here. 
The NFL remains massively popular despite whatever supposed “wokeness” they find.
I question the degree to which cultural beefs play out in box office. 
Increased diversity is inevitable in society. Whether Disney is motivated by progressive ideals or money-making, this is the way

[Brainbug]

How many goats do i have to sacrifice for 15M+ for Dominion today?

 

[wildphantom]

49 minutes ago, Ipickthiswhiterose said:

Just come back from Lightyear. I'm writing my thoughts before reading anything else on the thread.

 

It is one of the most tonally bizarre films I've ever seen.

 

It's a film with a talking cat and yet it's closer to Solaris, Ad Astra and Moon than any other films you'd ever see with a talking cat. 

 

Sure, some of these are Sci-Fi themes, but geez, they needed to be tempered with some actual fun. This is a miserable, dank film.

 

I have been in the movie theatre watching Sonic 2, Bad Guys, TGM and JW and seen enthusiastic kids in all even though I didn't love the first and last of those one bit.  There were no enthusiastic kids in this showing. Just glum faces, which is all this movie seems to want anytime Sox isnt on screen.

 

The only save I'll say is that I feel somewhat similar about Wall-E and that was embraced. Albeit embraced in the absolute premium era for Pixar.

 

I just dont get it. I don't get what the thinking was when of all the ways they could have done a Buzz Lightyear movie they chose THIS.

 

And I certainly wouldn't be surprised if numbers and estimates for this just go. down and down

 

 

Agree with much of what you said when I’ve got my ‘do the most obvious, laziest cash-in’ hat on. 

But I’m so glad it’s not that. It’s tone for me was consistent throughout. It’s a sci-fi mission movie for older kids and grown ups. It never really dumbs itself down and sticks to its guns. I admire that about it.  

[Ryan Reynolds]

2 minutes ago, Brainbug the Dinosaur said:

How many goats do i have to sacrifice for 15M+ for Dominion today?

 

leave Tom Cruise alone

[RichWS]

"It's inflation!"

"It's the kiss!" 

"It's the lack of Tim Allen!"
"It's Game 7!"

 

It's because this was a dumb project no one was ever interested in. The trailers were always lame.

[wildphantom]

3 minutes ago, Brainbug the Dinosaur said:

How many goats do i have to sacrifice for 15M+ for Dominion today?

 

 

a few!