The Disney Thread | Happy 90th to Donald Duck!

[Bob Train]

1 hour ago, ZattMurdock said:

Because the whole operation was ran basically as a sweat shop:

 

https://www.vulture.com/2023/06/spider-verse-animation-four-artists-on-making-the-sequel.html

 

 

It’s absolutely tragic to see people using Across the Spider-Verse’s production budget as the template going forward. Yes, Across the Spider-Verse is an work of art, one of my favorite films of the year and one of my favorite animations of all time, arguably tied for my favorite Spider-Man film, but it isn’t a project that we should be parading around as the role model for the industry going forward. 

So ATSV with $100m-$150m budget is a "sweatshop" but Raya with $100m budget is not? Strange World had $135m budget. Frozen 2 had $150m budget. Soul had a $150m budget. This conversation doesn't make any sense, because there are recent WDAS/Pixar movies that have similar budgets to Spider-Verse. 

 

It's only movies with A-list actors like Onward or where new tech was developed like Elemental where Disney's budgets are more expensive.

1 hour ago, Porthos said:

Gonna say something about budgets now that I feel I'm going to be saying a LOT over the next two, three, even four years.

 

INFLATION SHOULD BE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT WHEN TALKING ABOUT FILM BUDGETS

 

It was already bordering on nonsensical to compare a $100m budget of a 2012 film to a $100m 2019 film.  After the inflationary spike of the last three or so years, it's gonna be so much more so.

 

Now inflation calculators are at best a rough guide, but...

 

2012:  $100 ≈  2023: $134

 

Hell, according to the same calculator....

 

2019: $100 ≈  2023: $120

 

To put it a different way...

 

2023: 100m ≈ 2012: 74.6m

2023: 100m ≈ 2019: 83.3m

 

Just something else to keep in mind as we look at budgets this decade.

100%.

 

 

[Eric Prime]

 

[Jonwo]

TBH I'm surprised WDAS wasn't fully unionised. 

[ZattMurdock]

50 minutes ago, Bob Train said:

So ATSV with $100m-$150m budget is a "sweatshop" but Raya with $100m budget is not? Strange World had $135m budget. Frozen 2 had $150m budget. Soul had a $150m budget. This conversation doesn't make any sense, because there are recent WDAS/Pixar movies that have similar budgets to Spider-Verse. 

 

It's only movies with A-list actors like Onward or where new tech was developed like Elemental where Disney's budgets are more expensive.

100%.

 

 

Forgive me but I don’t even know what Raya is, I do know that Spider-Verse is my favorite western animation series of films and like it’s exposed on that article, it’s made with a lot of love by underpaid and insane amounts of crunch. People working 15 hours a day in a passion project and for a Visa so they can live their dream as animators. If you don’t understand why that matters and how Sony has a history of that with Sausage Party a few years before this, I don’t know what to tell you.

 

Shit is wrong. People here unanimously called out once the news broke months ago, myself included, despite loving the film. No reason to turn everything into an argument, dude.

[Porthos]

18 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

Forgive me but I don’t even know what Raya is

 

Raya and the Last Dragon, which came out just as the first COVID restrictions were being lifted. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Porthos

[ZattMurdock]

1 minute ago, Porthos said:

 

Raya and the Last Dragon, which came out just as the first COVID restrictions were being lifted. 

I have no idea what that is, I barely watch most of the new Pixar films, let alone Disney’s animation. I do think that Disney animators unionizing - and the budget for Pixar films being bigger than the Spider-Verse films - is a good thing. Across the Spider-Verse should cost at least just as much as a Pixar film, not the other way around. I bet that if Pixar tried something like AtSV, their budget would have to be likely even bigger.

[Potiki]

5 hours ago, Porthos said:

 

Gonna tag @keysersoze123 as I think they play in the world of finance. @Potiki is very knowledgeable about the ins and outs of the streaming landscape so they'd be my personal Go To source on parsing this.

 

Hell, while I'm at might as well bug @ZeeSoh as well since I he's fairly in tune with the Financial World.

 

Context for all those I'm tagging:

 

 

 

The difference comes from lack of funding from Comcast towards Hulu being deducted:

 

"Disney expects it will pay NBCU approximately $8.61 billion, representing NBCU’s equity ownership percentage of the guaranteed floor value of approximately $9.17 billion (the “guaranteed purchase price”) minus the outstanding NBCU capital call contributions under the Hulu Agreement payable to Disney, currently approximately $567 million, if the full amount of such outstanding capital call contributions remains unpaid on such date." 

 

source: https://app.quotemedia.com/data/downloadFiling?webmasterId=90423&ref=317835503&type=PDF&symbol=DIS&cdn=cb9e09bc8758554b71e7078a62ca080c&companyName=The+Walt+Disney+Company&formType=8-K&formDescription=Current+report+pursuant+to+Section+13+or+15(d)&dateFiled=2023-11-01

 

As for the valuation difference between Disney, Comcast and the market have to wait to see how things play out but I think it will depend on how Hulu is valued (if firms are using Netflix, Disney, streaming growth, future potential, revenue growth etc.) they could spit out a bunch of different valuations which likely means a third firm will be involved and could just be luck really. Important to note that September 30th is the date that they have to work out the valuation of Hulu as an asset so any changes to stock prices, company changes etc. since then shouldn't have an impact. 

 

Personally I believe the more bearish sentiment towards streaming the last 12-18 months will benefit Disney but that has been my guess for some time. I could be wrong I haven't followed a transaction like this before, I'm not sure many have, so could really go in any direction. 

[Porthos]

12 minutes ago, Potiki said:

The difference comes from lack of funding from Comcast towards Hulu being deducted:

 

"Disney expects it will pay NBCU approximately $8.61 billion, representing NBCU’s equity ownership percentage of the guaranteed floor value of approximately $9.17 billion (the “guaranteed purchase price”) minus the outstanding NBCU capital call contributions under the Hulu Agreement payable to Disney, currently approximately $567 million, if the full amount of such outstanding capital call contributions remains unpaid on such date." 

 

                   OH, OF COURSE!!!

 

====

 

Actually that does make sense!  Thanks. 👍

 

Though why THR didn't bother to mention that, I have no idea.  One might see why I was a tad confused.

 

(now that you mention it, I remember seeing a story about that spat between Comcast and Disney over Hulu earlier today, but I didn't look into it that deeply)

Edited November 2, 2023 by Porthos

[Mojoguy]

1 hour ago, ZattMurdock said:

I have no idea what that is, I barely watch most of the new Pixar films, let alone Disney’s animation. I do think that Disney animators unionizing - and the budget for Pixar films being bigger than the Spider-Verse films - is a good thing. Across the Spider-Verse should cost at least just as much as a Pixar film, not the other way around. I bet that if Pixar tried something like AtSV, their budget would have to be likely even bigger.

Raya came out in 2021, the year when the US was under lockdown and movies were the last thing on people's minds. People were still questioning whether theaters would survive. You can be excused for not knowing much about it.

[WittyUsername]

I don’t get why Disney is trying to buy Comcast’s share of Hulu when they’re in hard times financially. 

[lorddemaxus]

6 hours ago, Jonwo said:

TBH I'm surprised WDAS wasn't fully unionised. 

Blame Disney for that

 

https://www.cartoonbrew.com/artist-rights/disney-animation-production-workers-animation-guild-226794.html

[cannastop]

Pixar is not union at all btw.

[eddyxx]

10 hours ago, Eric Presley said:

 

Walt Disney is rolling over in his grave right now.

[Jonwo]

7 hours ago, WittyUsername said:

I don’t get why Disney is trying to buy Comcast’s share of Hulu when they’re in hard times financially. 

Disney has a lot of money, the idea they're cash strapped is simply not true. 

[TwoMisfits]

7 hours ago, WittyUsername said:

I don’t get why Disney is trying to buy Comcast’s share of Hulu when they’re in hard times financially. 

 

B/c they already agreed that they had to do so 5 years ago...not their best decision, and one Comcast is making them live with...

[SchumacherFTW]

6 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

B/c they already agreed that they had to do so 5 years ago...not their best decision, and one Comcast is making them live with...

Comcast did a lot to fuck Disney, they drove up the price of Fox, then bought out from under them one of the most valuable parts (the sky satellite operation in Europe). Genius play on their part. 

[SpiderByte]

8 billion for Disney is almost nothing though. In September they announced 60 billion for the Parks. 8 for full control of Hulu is honestly a steal, id have guessed at least 10.

[Jonwo]

22 minutes ago, SpiderByte said:

8 billion for Disney is almost nothing though. In September they announced 60 billion for the Parks. 8 for full control of Hulu is honestly a steal, id have guessed at least 10.

It was rumoured to be high as $26bn.

 

The $60bn for the parks and other ventures is over 10 years but does show Disney isn't exactly going under.

[SpiderByte]

One of the Blade writers contests accuracy of Varietys article:

 

[WittyUsername]

They’ve obviously shown a questionable track record at best, but MyTimeToShine is claiming that Marvel does not in fact plan on replacing Kang with Dr. Doom.