Game of Thrones (TV ONLY) [Leaked Spoilers prohibited]

[Agafin]

Somewhat overhyped episode but not bad. Far fewer main characters died than I was expecting though. And Arya is now pretty much an anime character lol

 

 

[Ozymandias]

Sauron cause of death: 

 

Night King cause of death:

 

 

I think we can all agree who the better Dark Lord of fantasy is.

[The Panda]

Also, I think this might be Djawadi’s best number for the show

 

 

[AndyK]

8 hours ago, filmlover said:

We still have 3 episodes (and a final showdown with Cersei) to go.

All their armies are wiped out.....What are they going to fight Cersei with, brans ravens?

 

 

[CloneWars]

Since the first episode of season one, this has been hyped as the one war, the only war that matters....

 

I don't know. It just feels anti-climatic for what was supposed to be the most important war.

 

So, let me guess, we get one episode of planning an attack on Cersei

 

An episode where they attack Cersei and more people die

 

A final closing episode.

 

Sounds lame. Sorry.

[CloneWars]

1 hour ago, AndyK said:

All their armies are wiped out.....What are they going to fight Cersei with, brans ravens?

 

 

They have Arya. Just send the assassin and get it over with.

[Valonqar]

that's a sound idea. Arya kills Cersei. impersonates her to call off the attack, sign eternal peace treaty and abdicate. Boom.

[Jonan23]

I have no problem with Arya's big moment. If only more people had died during the episode then we could have been so emotionally drained by that point that Arya's attack would have come as a bittersweet relief. The episode failed to put us in a frame to really feel it.
I watched it again and the plotting problems are more apparent.

I started to worry when Grey Worm didn't die as Mellisandre lit the trench. The set up was perfect for a heroic sacrifice. Grey Worm and a group of elite unsullied sacrifice themselves buying time for the red witch. It would have been appropriate for the unsullied. It would have been dramatic. It would have added a consequence to Dany not being able to see the signal. It would have made the trench lighting up even more victorious.

But adjusting the brightness made it easy to see and I also appreciated the technical aspects a lot more.

 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Jonan23

[DAR]

Rewatched the episode again through Prime which I guess is a version of HBO Now.   And turned up the brightness just a smidge.  Had no trouble making anything out.

 

And I certainly understand the criticisms.  But for me it worked 

Edited April 30, 2019 by DAR

[Jonan23]

I will say this though. The memes, reactions, and videos have been hilarious and include some really creative gems like the edited Tywin speech posted earlier.

[K1stpierre]

I’m shocked HBO has their shit together this season, last season there were spoiler leaks everywhere episode 1.

[RichWS]

It's been haunting me all day: How did Samwell not die? Sure, keep cutting to him screaming and running for his life.

[MrPink]

1 hour ago, RichWS said:

It's been haunting me all day: How did Samwell not die? Sure, keep cutting to him screaming and running for his life.

 

He inherited the plot armor Ramsay Bolton was wearing till he forgot to wear it for Battle of the Bastards. +100 DEF

[Valonqar]

9 hours ago, K1stpierre said:

I’m shocked HBO has their shit together this season, last season there were spoiler leaks everywhere episode 1.

Arya's big moment and Zombie Lyanna leaked 4 months ago but not by Frikileaks so fans didn't believe it. Now they are revising that leak cause there's more that hasn't happened yet.

 

@Jonan23 That and also you don't make everyone useless and stupid just to prop one character. I think that the episode would go over much better if everyone got something memorable to do (everyone being main characters) so that it wasn't just for Arya fans. cause right now, the only fans that are uncritically happy with the whole thing are Arya fans and it should have been that everyone was happy how it turned out including Jon fans accepting that Arya taking out NK was the right thing. But they didn't execute it well. 

 

Example of good execution is IW, IMO. The movie was building up to Thor creating a weapon that would destroy Thanos. Everyone was given something memorable to do (minus Quill's emotionally charged stupidity) and Thor arrivals in wakanda changed the course of the battle. Good guys are now winning. then we get the shocking Hell yeah moment when Stormbreaker logs into Thanos chest. But he's protected by the stones so "next time aim for the head...snap". So what happened didn't undermine Thor. he didn't kill Thanos not because he was stupid or whatever but because Thanos is legit hard to kill thanks to the stones. You can't kill him in a battle. you can't assassinate him. you just can't. 

 

However, what Long Night did wrong is that it literally rendered the biggest army ever assembled pointless cause the only way to take NK out was assassination, and easy one at that. so when you watch the episode, you wonder why the heck Dothraki had to charge the zombies, etc and why they didn't just take Bran somewhere farther from Winterfell and have Arya with him to sneak upon NK at the right moment since it wasn't hard at all. that would have saved lives. Mind you, this isn't just Long Night's problem. It was Knight of the Seven Kingdom's too. When Bran told everyone that NK knew where he was, many people were, like, than why are you endangering everyone at Winterfell? Like, that little shit could have told them long time ago, move the fuck out, and redirect NK interest elsewhere. So lots of stupid leading up to the big battle that didn't have to happen cause you couldn't take him (and everyone else) out without a stealth assassination. 

 

Now instead of having an episode that holds up, it falls apart the more you think about it and drags other stuff on the show with it, leaving only one specific fandom satisfied cause they literally only care about the big moment and not about shit surrounding it. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Valonqar

[charlie Jatinder]

9 hours ago, K1stpierre said:

I’m shocked HBO has their shit together this season, last season there were spoiler leaks everywhere episode 1.

They did worse this time. Making it predictable.

[gadd]

1 hour ago, Valonqar said:

Arya's big moment and Zombie Lyanna leaked 4 months ago but not by Frikileaks so fans didn't believe it. Now they are revising that leak cause there's more that hasn't happened yet.

 

@Jonan23 That and also you don't make everyone useless and stupid just to prop one character. I think that the episode would go over much better if everyone got something memorable to do (everyone being main characters) so that it wasn't just for Arya fans. cause right now, the only fans that are uncritically happy with the whole thing are Arya fans and it should have been that everyone was happy how it turned out including Jon fans accepting that Arya taking out NK was the right thing. But they didn't execute it well. 

 

Example of good execution is IW, IMO. The movie was building up to Thor creating a weapon that would destroy Thanos. Everyone was given something memorable to do (minus Quill's emotionally charged stupidity) and Thor arrivals in wakanda changed the course of the battle. Good guys are now winning. then we get the shocking Hell yeah moment when Stormbreaker logs into Thanos chest. But he's protected by the stones so "next time aim for the head...snap". So what happened didn't undermine Thor. he didn't kill Thanos not because he was stupid or whatever but because Thanos is legit hard to kill thanks to the stones. You can't kill him in a battle. you can't assassinate him. you just can't. 

 

However, what Long Night did wrong is that it literally rendered the biggest army ever assembled pointless cause the only way to take NK out was assassination, and easy one at that. so when you watch the episode, you wonder why the heck Dothraki had to charge the zombies, etc and why they didn't just take Bran somewhere farther from Winterfell and have Arya with him to sneak upon NK at the right moment since it wasn't hard at all. that would have saved lives. Mind you, this isn't just Long Night's problem. It was Knight of the Seven Kingdom's too. When Bran told everyone that NK knew where he was, many people were, like, than why are you endangering everyone at Winterfell? Like, that little shit could have told them long time ago, move the fuck out, and redirect NK interest elsewhere. So lots of stupid leading up to the big battle that didn't have to happen cause you couldn't take him (and everyone else) out without a stealth assassination. 

 

Now instead of having an episode that holds up, it falls apart the more you think about it and drags other stuff on the show with it, leaving only one specific fandom satisfied cause they literally only care about the big moment and not about shit surrounding it. 

If they'd sent Bran further south, they may have had to confront the Army of the Dead anyway as they were ploughing through everything in their path. Also, given that the whole thematic motivation for the fight at Winterfell was key characters putting their differences aside and coming together to face a common enemy, diverting the Night King away only for him and his army to potentially kill innocent people and add to their army if things went wrong would've lied in opposition to that rationale. We also saw what happened last season when a group of characters in this battle tried a sneak attack on the Army of the Dead...it didn't go too well, gifting the Night King a dragon. 
The assassination didn't dawn on Arya until the mid-way point when Melisandre reminded her of the vision she had. If I remember correctly, S08E02 established that Jon and Daenerys would try to take out the Night King in the Godswood. Daenerys ended up getting her opportunity much earlier than expected, took it, only to realise it was futile. Jon was clearly oblivious to the significance of Arya because he was running at the end to try to get to Bran. The issue in all of this is Bran himself, which is why I'm starting to buy into the suggestion that when he was warging, he revisited his reunion with Arya and instigated the exchange of the dagger. Why else would they establish his ability to move through time, and why else would he give her that dagger? His final expression of gratitude to Theon ties into this, as he seemed to demonstrate an awareness of the latter's fate. He's basically taken on the Dr. Strange role, conveniently not being able to tell people of the plan because it if he did, it might affect the outcome.
All of the deaths in the episode had a purpose too. Edd died saving Sam, Lyanna died taking out a Giant who would have ended the battle much earlier, Beric saved Arya which had an obvious significance, Jorah died protecting Daenerys which made narrative and thematic sense, Theon brought Bran and inadvertedly Arya a few more minutes and got a fitting conclusion to his character arc, and Melisandre already told us last season that she would return to Westeros and die, but implied that she would do something important in the process (which she totally did). Hence, I don't agree with the idea that they elevated Arya and gave everyone else the short shrift. And while those who survived didn't get many notable moments, well, that's why they're alive, because they probably will in the next 3 episodes. It's a totally valid point to suggest that there needed to be more deaths to showcase the horror of the situation, but, at least for me, watching characters like Brienne and Sam for 8 seasons only to see them get devoured by wights would've been underwhelming.

Edited April 30, 2019 by gadd

[Valonqar]

that's constructive debate is good. You liked the execution and explained why, I didn't and explained why. we won't convert one another but we respect each other's arguments. 

[Lordmandeep]

As I said the problem was not that Arya Kills the NK...

Its that the NK is not the final boss.

[Valonqar]

13 minutes ago, Lordmandeep said:

As I said the problem was not that Arya Kills the NK...

Its that the NK is not the final boss.

I think the problem is this. the show had the books as the source for about half of its run and then had to make do on their own. so whatever books set up, rubbed off on the show creating the feel that set up is for one thing, while the writing (whether due to lack of input from GRRM or simply free to write whatever) took it to another direction. so you have a conflict between book set up that NK is the boss (where Cersei isn't nearly dominant as she is on the show), vs the show where Cersei power is stretched way over the limit of tolerance (Jaimie staying with her after the Sept blow up is the main offender) and where she is over-dominant cause popular meme. here's no question that the show has been dependent on popularity rankings and think pieces for at least 3 seasons, hence over-reliance on plot armory, pandering to meme driven culture that only wants something cool whether it makes sense or not and out of character behavior. yet residues from book-driven seasons made many fans hopeful that things were going in different direction, which they clearly didn't. But as is always the case with fandom, they are too married to their headcanons to see what's obvious. In this case, there was no way that NK lived past episode 3 especially with Jon spelling out in episode 2 that they had to kill him to kill all the dead. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Valonqar

[4815162342]

Arya killing the NK was great.

 

But her just apparating out of nowhere was poor execution.

 

It would have been more effective/tense if we got some glimpses of her setting up the ambush, and the payoff even better as we first go out no her strategy failed, and then she recovers for the kill shot.

Edited April 30, 2019 by 4815162342